[LANMaster]

Originally posted by THoey:
LM, I think CNM was saying that the U.S. was going to do a preemptive (any) strike, causing Saddam to use the WMD's that he says he doesn't have. Not that the U.S. was going to do a preemptive NUCLEAR strike.

Quote: (not sure by who)
Deploying a nuclear weapon is a fairly easy thing to do
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CNM's response;
Yes, and launching a first-strike attack on Iraq is a fairly easy way to provoke one. Along with other terrorist retaliations which would almost be justified.

That must be how I read in the nuclear angle.

[boyoh53]

Easy answer, No !!!

[$teve]

DN you're actually suggesting that the US use a surrogate nation, Iran, to fight a war to further American interests? Should we funnel the weapons through some Central American country, but have some low level colonel run the operation so as to allow plausible deniability. Should we use the CIA to teach covert operations to assassination squads in Iran? Oh, the possibilities are endless!

gb,i think this tactic has been done before....several times

[GoneForNow]

THE SPOILS OF GLORY
Written by William F. Buckley Jr.

The whole world, it seems, hangs on the future within NATO of the current dispute. The sense of it, in parts of Europe, is that Germany accidentally tripped into its present position. For one, there was -- there is -- the brooding matter of its military-imperialist past, and the sense that binds it, as it does Japan, in those postwar loincloths of innocence that make Machtpolitik something of an impiety, let alone a question of tanks and missiles and bayonets.

There came then the accidental success of marginal candidate Gerhard Shroeder, who brushed the anti-American cream off the top of the electoral vat and scored an upset victory. He and Germany are stuck with it, and will come around on the matter of help to Turkey only if a formula sufficiently emasculating is contrived.

The plight of France is brilliantly examined by the Strategic Forecasting Intelligence unit http://www.stratfor.com of Texas. The analyst reminds us of the basic problem of modern
France, which is that it isn't strong enough to figure dominantly on the international scene by the mere deployment of its geopolitical or commercial resources. This requires a very heavy load on its cultural resources. These are form-idable, but how many operas comiques are needed to float out the single French aircraft carrier? The Charles de Gaulle has scarcely left harbor during its accident-prone existence. The British sage Paul Johnson, summarizing France's straitened military, writes that "there is no chance of the French cutting a bella figura in any hostilities, and so the easy way out for her is to oppose them."

The aircraft carrier's eponym intuited the problem in 1966, when as president of France, he dramatically pulled the French out of the NATO administration. He did not pull out
of NATO -- France is still a member of that alliance, but the authority to deploy French military remains that of France alone. It is because of that rupture that the NATO
administration was relocated to Brussels, where it sits cheek by jowl with the European Union. If every one of the NATO powers were to abide by de Gaulle's maxims -- never
divest yourself of your own power, but engage in ad hoc alignments to magnify that power -- a stable alliance would be impossible. And the challenge of Iraq is
illustrating an instability we'd have done better to anticipate more skillfully.

What we have now, of course, is the unexpungeable challenge of taming the Iraqi beast, and the need to absorb a NATO alliance with room given for the caprice of the two major
nations of -- old Europe.

The parliamentarians are getting great exercise in the libertine theater. There is the sense of independence not only from the power of the superpower, but from the
restraints that attach to ordered rhetoric. Belgium wants, no less, to try Gen. Ariel Sharon after he leaves office as a war criminal. That is the kind of thing against which
cool heads warned when Gen. Pinochet suddenly found himself a prisoner in London.

Donald Rumsfeld let it fly against Germany that in behaving as it lately has, it is in the same league as Cuba and Libya. That did it to Germany's defense minister, Peter Struck,
who, taking a firm grip on his pince nez, fumed that what Rumsfeld said was "beyond impertinent. ... It isn't acceptable. It is out of order. It is even un-American."

"In recent months," writes Paul Johnson in National Review, the anti-American pitch "has surpassed itself in its fury at the notion of 'Texas adolescents' wielding more power
than 'European sophisticates.' Mixed in this bouillabaisse of rage are anti-Semitism, a distrust of popular democracy, frustrated socialism, and a smug use of French cultural
superiority."

What to do? "When the French elites are in such a mood, they are beyond the reach of argument and are best ignored."

COPYRIGHT 2003 UNIVERSAL PRESS SYNDICATE

[Mulderator]

Originally posted by eggplant43:
Syndicated columnist Molly Ivins is the rarest of political animals: a smart liberal

Well, one thing is right, a smart liberal is rare, but Ivins sure as hell doesn't fall into that category!

[LANMaster]

Great quote gbrumb.

WF Buckly is one of my favs.

[LANMaster]

MANILA, Philippines — With or without weapons of mass destruction, Saddam Hussein is a “grave danger,” particularly to his own people, a former Iraqi nuclear scientist said Tuesday.

And in the interest of space, here's a link to this story.
I think this is just another spotlight on why SH needs to be removed by force, and sooner rather than later.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,78875,00.html

[GoneForNow]

Originally posted by LANMaster:
Great quote gbrumb.

WF Buckly is one of my favs.

WFB is the pundit for the thinking conservative; which is why you won't see Mulder quoting him.

[Mulderator]

Originally posted by gbrumb:
WFB is the pundit for the thinking conservative; which is why you won't see Mulder quoting him.

I've quoted him a number of times on here. Do a search my misinformed friend!!!

[Mulderator]

http://forums.techguy.org/showthread...919#post537919

Mulder said:

JH, I'm shocked--your citing Jonah Goldberg! He's a conservative columnist whom you'll find listed at http://www.townhall.com/columnists/ along with a few of eggy's favorite sources: Olly North, William F. Buckley, Larry Elder, David Horowitz, David Limbaugh, Bill O'Reilly and, last but not least, the lovely Ann Coulter!

[GoneForNow]

Originally posted by Mulder:
I've quoted him a number of times on here. Do a search my misinformed friend!!!

Mulder said:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JH, I'm shocked--your citing Jonah Goldberg! He's a conservative columnist whom you'll find listed at http://www.townhall.com/columnists/ along with a few of eggy's favorite sources: Olly North, William F. Buckley, Larry Elder, David Horowitz, David Limbaugh, Bill O'Reilly and, last but not least, the lovely Ann Coulter!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mulder it was a joke, see the little "wink" and "smiley face" at the end of my original statement. Lighten up.

[Mulderator]

Originally posted by gbrumb:
Mulder it was a joke, see the little "wink" and "smiley face" at the end of my original statement. Lighten up.

I never thought it wasn't a joke, my paranoid friend!

[n2gun]

N.C. Restaurant Sells 'Freedom Fries'
The Associated Press
BEAUFORT, N.C.

You can get fries with your burger at a restaurant here, but just don't ask for french fries.

Neal Rowland, the owner of Cubbie's, now only sells his fried potato strips as "freedom fries" _ a decision that comes as Americans watch French officials back away from support for possible war in Iraq.

"Because of Cubbie's support for our troops, we no longer serve french fries. We now serve freedom fries," says a sign in the restaurant's window.

Rowland said his intent is not to slight the French people, but to take a patriotic stance to show his support for the United States and the actions of President Bush.

"It's our way of showing our patriotic pride," he said, noting that his business has a lot of local military troops as customers.

Rowland said the switch from french fries to freedom fries came to mind after a conversation about World War I when anti-German sentiment prompted Americans to rename German foods like sauerkraut and frankfurter to liberty cabbage and hot dog.
Wednesday, Feb. 19, 2003

[DNeurococo]

GB – Buckley’s article (your post #397), seemed to me like his usual snobby observations coupled with pretentious diction.

He impugns low motives to France (I thought the evil motive was supposed to be France’s ECONOMIC ties, not their relative military weakness - - the right-wing should get their story straight).

Buckley attributes Germany’s present stance to the “accidental success” of Shroeder - - despite the fact that some 70% of the population of Germany objects to war with Iraq - - so, you have to ask yourself just how “accidental” Shroeder’s victory was.

Of course, Buckley doesn’t even bother to dream up explanations for the political position of the people of Italy, Spain, Denmark, Hungary, Poland, etc. - - I guess his article would have been way too long.

Buckley ends his piece with “What to do? ‘When the French elites [Why elites? The French population supports that stand.] are in such a mood, they are beyond the reach of argument and are best ignored.’"

Unfortunately for Buckley, France (who once, in a similar mood of pique, advised the U.S. not to get entangled in Vietnam) cannot just be ignored. Neither can the many other countries that oppose this war. The U.S. is obligated under law (the “highest law of the land”) to honor treaties ratified by Congress - - such as the U.N. treaty - - which obligates the U.S. to refrain from using military force as a means of settling differences.

P.S. Odd article for Buckley - - who usually spends most of his time kissing the arse of Europeans, quoting European History, and using pretentious foreign phrases.

[LANMaster]

<img src= "http://forums.techguy.org/attachment.php?postid=735176 ">