Following all of the religious debate going on and sounding people out has proved to be very interesting so far, so I would like to go a little further with ... your ... help.

This poll offers only two choices:

1. ONE Absolute Scientific belief (established scientifically through Lay teaching) or,

2. Many Hopeful Religious beliefs (established by ceremonial observance, etc.)

The question is really this. If non-religious Lay teachers could convince you of the existance of God ... beyond ... any ... shadow of doubt, would you prefer this method of teaching to current religion?

If, instead of the apparent "moralising" of the Church, would you ALSO prefer Lay teachers to teach moral ethics to you and your children, according to decency standards and ethical behaviour, rather than directly according to religion?

The reason I ask is because I see a great deal of superstition rather than PURE belief and really good social morality.

I will NOT be "bashing" anyone as I would like to hear from all members of the community, irrespective of current religious OR non-religious practise.

Serious replies only please, as I would like to establish a really deep concern amongst all people regarding the future and where we are all going, especially with regard to poverty and crime.

The thinking behind all of this is to put a STOP to sectarian factional infighting between ALL people over religious belief and establish a CLEAR understanding based mostly in a scientific appreciation of GOD, His Creation, and the role YOU play in formulating a peaceful society, which is ABLE to fully comprehend the Eternal and the Infinite nature of God and His Universe.

"Hergé"

NOTE: Another reason why I ask this is because of recently discovering that there are many declared "Aethiests" who actually profess an absolute belief in The Almighty based ... purely ... in science.

AND There is also ... The Laicity who are Freethinking.

[RandyG]

If you want a good discussion, then you can't limit the poll to 2 possibilities that reflect the same thought, just different methodologies.

I believe in God in my way. We can follow scientific methodologies only so far before we come to the understanding that our "Science" is nothing more than a modern day religion. It is based on premise and conjecture at it's roots, and then establishing fact built on that hypothesis. Religion is based in the same thing, a basic belief that there is something greater.

Both involve getting people together and agreeing upon some more advanced precepts, still based on the original theory.


So, neither of your choices above will work, so your poll is doomed, cause it is too limited.

My version of God will have some similarities to your version of God, but which one of us is correct??

The answer is neither, because if we could get a complete understanding of God, or even enough of one to begin to describe him and ascribe personality traits, then we have become a greater being in and of ourselves, making the entire point moot.

Some basic precepts of a God that I think most, if not all, people can accept are:

. . .

. . .

. . .


did you get all of that??



Now, on to morality. You can't follow the Golden Rule, cause someone who is a masochist or pedophile would be allowed to do that unto others.


Dude - we were all kicked out of Eden for a reason (if you follow the Judeo-Christian mythos) and this is our lot. make the best of it by being true to yourself, cause that's the only person you will ever be able to convert! Leave the rest of the world to do it's bit, one person at a time. If we had less people trying to convert others, we wouldn't have Religious wars, would we?

Originally posted by RandyG:
If you want a good discussion, then you can't limit the poll to 2 possibilities that reflect the same thought, just different methodologies.

I believe in God in my way. We can follow scientific methodologies only so far before we come to the understanding that our "Science" is nothing more than a modern day religion.

It is based on premise and conjecture at it's roots, and then establishing fact built on that hypothesis. Religion is based in the same thing, a basic belief that there is something greater.

Both involve getting people together and agreeing upon some more advanced precepts, still based on the original theory.

So, neither of your choices above will work, as this poll is too limited.

My version of God will have some similarities to your version of God, but which one of us is correct?

The answer is neither, because if we could get a complete understanding of God, or even enough of one to begin to describe him and ascribe personality traits, then we have become a greater being in and of ourselves, making the entire point moot.

Some basic precepts of a God that I think most, if not all, people can accept are: . . . . . . . . . did you get all of that?

*No but you can PM me on the three S's if it is morse.*

Now, on to morality. You can't follow the Golden Rule, because someone who is a masochist or pedophile would be allowed to do that unto others.

We were all kicked out of Eden for a reason (if you follow the Judeo-Christian mythos) and this is our lot. Make the best of it by being true to yourself, because that's the only person you will ever be able to convert! Leave the rest of the world to do it's bit, one person at a time. If we had less people trying to convert others, we wouldn't have Religious wars, would we?

Hello Randy,

Let us choose science then, as you agree that it is a modern day belief system.

I think that you will agree that the scientific FACT of our existance is the SAME as the actual FACT of our existance.

We can now discount religion, together with superstition, and concentrate on FACT.

So, rather than many religions vying with each other to convert people from one religion to another we need only convert everyone to ONE science and ONE belief.

If you take a look at the Pyramids at Ghiza you will see BOTH science AND religion expressed as ONE belief system.

Not surprising, as this is precisely where our knowledge of God comes from. It is the foundation of Earthly religion.

In translation to the Bible the Three Wise Men ARE, in FACT, the three main Pyramids.

I put it to you that science is the discipline of the ORDERED mind whereas religion is the ... wanderings ... of the disordered mind.

Therefore the less religion and the more science we use, the more order will be established from the present chaos.

I have DELIBERATELY limited the poll to two choices because both of them deal with the SAME subject of God.

However science is a MUCH Faster way to learn to appreciate origin, how everything was brought into being, and by Whom.

So, rather than discuss a plethora of religious beliefs, why not just take a look at ONE scientific belief.

Reading your reply I would have thought that you would vote for science.

My sincere thanks for your invaluable input.

I will now edit the question.

Have a nice day on the Emerald Isle.

"Hergé"