[plschwartz]

Cheesy films:
below if a story from the BBC on Cheesy moments in recent films. I am thinking of my list. Please post yours:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertain...ic/3235051.stm
Independence Day tops 'cheesy' poll
Cheesy moment: Top Gun made a star of Cruise
Bill Pullman's call to arms as US president in the film Independence Day has been named the cheesiest movie moment of all time by Empire magazine.

Pullman's "cornball speech" in the 1996 blockbuster led a cringe-making list.

Other top five entries included Top Gun ("You can be my wingman any time") and Four Weddings and A Funeral (Is it still raining? I hadn't noticed.")

Robin Williams was singled out by the magazine who likened his work to "being dipped in a churning vat of Camembert".


EMPIRE'S CHEESY LIST
1 - Independence Day
2 - Top Gun
3 - The Karate Kid
4 - Four Weddings...
5 - Pearl Harbor
6 - Stepmom
7 - The Postman
8 - An Officer and a Gentleman
9 - Patch Adams
10 - Star Wars Episode II: Attack of the Clones
Among a long line of cheesy roles, the magazine singles out a group of terminally-ill children turning up in court to save his comedy doctor character's career in Patch Adams.

But no other contender beat Pullman's "Today, we celebrate our Independence Day!", from the widely-panned fantasy movie.

Kate Beckinsale's reading of a love letter in front of an improbably beautiful sunset in Pearl Harbor came fifth on the list.

Kevin Costner earns a place for a scene in his flop film The Postman in which a blind woman tells him: "You're a godsend, a saviour."

"No, I'm just a postman", Costner solemnly replies.

Other cheesy moments to make the top 10 included Richard Gere sweeping Debra Winger off her feet at the end of An Officer And A Gentleman, and a romantic scene between Hayden Christensen and Natalie Portman in Star Wars Episode II: Attack Of The Clones.

Cancer-stricken Susan Sarandon leading her kids in a family sing-a-long during the weepie Stepmom also made the list.

[DNeurococo]

Interesting topic. I'm sure there are a lot more.

How about Tom Hank's crying about his lost volleyball in "Castaway"? "Wilson! . . . sob! . . . Wiiiiiiilson!". Even Wilson thought that Hanks was getting too intimate and wanted to get away!

I think Steven Spielberg has a heavy hand with the schmaltz.

Just about every scene of his is "father Flannigan helps the little blind orphan find his lost puppy on Christmas eve".

P.S. How "recent" do the recent films have to be? "Officer and Gentleman" is reaching back pretty far (1982).

#$DN

[Corrosive]

The entire James Bond series is cheesy, but does anyone care? Naaah...

[pyritechips]

Independance Day was one of the worst pieces of trash ever made!

It is an early example of neo-con propaganda, Hollywood's traditional patriotic pandering to the pulse of the American government is so obiquitous it has become an axiom. Look back at the glut of alien invasion movies of the 50's. The aliens were always hostlie and strong, metaphors of America's fears of Communist invasion. The "Independance Day" Aliens represent the growing hostility and danger of the Middle East.

Another dangerous aspect of the movie is the portrayal of the scientist in the "Area 51" scene. He is portrayed as a mentally unblalanced, repulsive character. Scientists represent logic and reason, a balanced viewpoint and also our intellectual state. His negative portrayal, along with Will Smith's cocky punching of the crashed alien implies that reason and diplomacy are a waste of time; might makes right and we are better off solving our problems with "brute strength and ignorance".

But the worst scene for me was the President's speech in front of a damaged White House. He said "We [nations of the world] cannot be consumed by petty differences". In other words, the world will do it the American way. He then claims "And if we should win the day, the fourth of July will no longer be known as an American holiday, but the day that the world declared in one voice...". There is also a demeaning scene where other world powers are seen sitting around, looking impotent and useless, awaiting their salvation by the Americans.

This is obviously an American propaganda "feel-good" movie made by, and for, Americans. Its portrayal of diplomatic and logical, rational solutions to complex issues as contempible is eerily prescient of the situation in Iraq, and America's [fortunately] failed attempt to usurp the UN as the global "voice of authority" and arbitrator.

Cheese? No, this disgusting movie is representitive of the high-cost, low quality garbage coming out of Hollywood lately. I give it an enormous thumbs down!

[Moby]

So . . . . . and I'm going out on a limb here . . . . . . but not one of your all time favs then Jim ?

[pyritechips]

LOL Steve! Whatever gave you that idea?

[Moby]

Well I don't like to boast, but it's a sort of 'inner eye' thing I have.

[GoneForNow]

PC..........A little over the top.

It is an early example of neo-con propaganda,

At the time of the movie the neo-cons had been rebuffed by George Sr. and Clinton was in the White House. They, the neo-cons, were not exerting any influence at the time. Might as well have blamed it on Baptists.

This is obviously an American propaganda "feel-good" movie made by, and for, Americans. Its portrayal of diplomatic and logical, rational solutions to complex issues as contempible is eerily prescient of the situation in Iraq, and America's [fortunately] failed attempt to usurp the UN as the global "voice of authority" and arbitrator.

First sentence is correct, with the response, so what?. So the movie demonstrates the thinking of a political administration which didn't exist at the time. I guess you could say that "Full Metal Jacket" was eerily prescient of the guerrilla warfare in Iraq.

[eggplant43]

Gee, you guys are describing all my favorite movies

[pyritechips]

PC..........A little over the top.

LOL yes gb, it was meant to be. Movies have no feelings so we can trash them as much as we want and they don't get insulted.

I didn't mean it to sound as if any particular government "commisioned" the movie. I was just saying that it reflected a rising sentiment, on that had been growing ever since the first gulf war.

But I believe I am close to the truth on the "might is right" sentiment. I think that there is a danger of America being seduced by, and overly reliant upon the sofistication of their war technology that they may forget how to talk to people.

[DNeurococo]

Well, well. If you are talking about over the top patriotic propaganda - - there are many films to choose from.

I was going to mention John Wayne in "Green Berets". But I thought that was too old a film.

There is a choice scene in "Gray Lady Down" (1978). A submarine is having mechanical troubles and lands on the bottom. Someone says something along the lines of "Wow! These babies are really built tough! Thank God!". Charlton Heston replies, "Yes, thank God, and GENERAL DYNAMICS"!

#$DN

[pyritechips]

LOL DN!

It's no secret that companies pay to have their products displayed or mentioned in movies. I wonder how much GD paid for that!

I was also going to mention Green Berets. From what I heard it was produced only to counter the deep anti-Viet Nam sentiment at the time. Wasn't it made shortly after Tet?

[DNeurococo]

Well, the Tet offensive was Jan. 31, 1968 and "Green Berets" was released sometime in 1968. Who knows how long it took to make, but it is a good bet that they started filming before Tet, and had a chance to edit/change dialogue AFTER Tet.

#$DN

[columbo]

I was also going to mention Green Berets. From what I heard it was produced only to counter the deep anti-Viet Nam sentiment at the time.

Yeah, that was a steaming pile of you-know-what if I ever saw one. It's been a while, but I especially remember how the previously skittish, weak and weasel-like (e.g. anti-American) reporter played by David Janssen, becomes so inspired by the heroism of Marion....I mean "John" and his men, that he picks up a gun to help them fight...

Here's a pretty accurate and humourous summation of the movie that I found:

"Wayne financed, co-directed and starred in this miserable 1968 attempt to resuscitate dying public support for America’s crusade in Indochina. Wayne pulls out all the propaganda stops in order to stir patriotic fervor in a U.S.A. he apparently thought was still willing to drink deeply from the well of jingoistic swill. Handsome GIs and attractive “good” Vietnamese contrast sharply with the preternaturally hideous faces of Viet Cong soldiers. A cynical liberal journalist played by David Janssen, once he has seen John Wayne in action, throws down his reporter’s notebook and picks up a carbine—gung ho to join the next Green Beret raid on a hamlet of, I suppose, hideously ugly V.C. sympathizers. As for Wayne’s performance—well, let’s just say he squints at the enemy the same way he did when he was killing Mexicans at the Alamo or Japanese at Iwo Jima or non-Mongols when he played Genghis Khan.

My favorite scene is the very end—not simply because I am anxious for the last reel to run out, but because it contains a blooper that is emblematic of the entire movie’s pack of untruths. Big John, after a glorious day of vanquishing hideously ugly bad guy Viets at Da Nang, puts his arm on the shoulder of a Vietnamese orphan and walks down the beach at sunset. Only problem is, this is the east coast of the Asian land mass—the sun here only rises over the ocean."

From: http://www.free-market.net/forums/mo...419726731.html

[ComputerFix]

Holy smokes Jim! In as friendly a tone as I can convey on-line.....less coffee.

Originally posted by pyritechips:
Independance Day was one of the worst pieces of trash ever made!

Just a movie, I liked it, but I like action/special effects wonders. Script based...I'll give it a so-so at best.

It is an early example of neo-con propaganda, Hollywood's traditional patriotic pandering to the pulse of the American government is so obiquitous it has become an axiom. Look back at the glut of alien invasion movies of the 50's. The aliens were always hostlie and strong, metaphors of America's fears of Communist invasion.

Can't really comment. Don't like them, didn't watch them. Thought they were cheesy and poorly made. Did they play off fear? Sure, I suppose. Most movies today do. Ever seen a horror movie?

However, Hollywood has always, even way back then, been associated with extreme liberalism, and even Communisim! I find it hard to believe that "they" would make movies portraying their ideology in a negative light.

It would be like you making a film which metaphorically portrayed peace activists as bad people that need to be quashed. What would be the logic in that?

The "Independance Day" Aliens represent the growing hostility and danger of the Middle East.

An entire race of beings that are far more combat resilient and possess a technology far superior than any other represents the Middle East? No offence to middle easterns, but in my view, it is their use of less sophisticated technology that is proving successful. We have bombs that can fly through a front door and ring the door bell before entering. "They" (I quote this as my intent is not to blanket all ME's as terrorists) hijacked airplanes with boxcutters and psycological effect, turning them into a weapon in the end. It doesn't get much less sophisticated than that.

Another dangerous aspect of the movie is the portrayal of the scientist in the "Area 51" scene. He is portrayed as a mentally unblalanced, repulsive character. Scientists represent logic and reason, a balanced viewpoint and also our intellectual state. His negative portrayal,....

Actually, I got a chuckle out of the actor used, and I'll put money that most "sci-fi" junkies did too. Who better than "Data" to be the scientist. As for the "weirdness", look at the position the character was in, and also consider that many of our most brilliant people do tend to have "social quirks". You will also notice that the character does take a fairly dry view of it all. Calling it "exciting" despite the destruction that was taking place. This rings true of someone who would view everything from a scientific view. I'll bet that viral specialists are facinated by some of the bugs they study, despite the fact that they represent horrific death to those infected.

along with Will Smith's cocky punching of the crashed alien implies that reason and diplomacy are a waste of time; might makes right and we are better off solving our problems with "brute strength and ignorance".

Exactly how does one reason with someone who is shooting at them? If someone fires a shot at me and misses, I'm not going to continue to try to talk them out of shooting at me, I'm gonna do what it takes to live, even physical violence. Wouldn't you?

But the worst scene for me was the President's speech in front of a damaged White House. He said "We [nations of the world] cannot be consumed by petty differences". In other words, the world will do it the American way. He then claims "And if we should win the day, the fourth of July will no longer be known as an American holiday, but the day that the world declared in one voice...". There is also a demeaning scene where other world powers are seen sitting around, looking impotent and useless, awaiting their salvation by the Americans.

Was it the worst because it was the American way, or because it was the succesful way, and was concieved by an American. (a Jewish one at that!)

This is obviously an American propaganda "feel-good" movie made by, and for, Americans. Its portrayal of diplomatic and logical, rational solutions to complex issues as contempible is eerily prescient of the situation in Iraq, and America's [fortunately] failed attempt to usurp the UN as the global "voice of authority" and arbitrator.

Cheese? No, this disgusting movie is representitive of the high-cost, low quality garbage coming out of Hollywood lately. I give it an enormous thumbs down! [/b]

Actually, it is a movie. Good or bad, just a chunk o entertainment.

Jim, I applaud your peaceful ideology, but as an intelligent person, and one I believe who is capable of understanding the complexities of human behavior, I would think that you would also understand that diplomacy and "talk" are not going to always resolve a situation satisfactorally for parties involved.

I got my arse beat by a bully all thru jr. high. Every avenue from parents to teachers to begging and bribes didn't stave the assult. Amazingly, swinging back, just once, and only once, did. Is it a good thing that I had to resort to violence? Not really, but the failure was his, not mine.