[LANMaster]

MoveOn Ads OK; Swift Boat Ads Not OK, Kerry Campaign Says

By Susan Jones
CNSNews.com Morning Editor
August 20, 2004

(CNSNews.com) - The Bush campaign has suggested that Sen. John Kerry join President Bush in calling off the dogs -- those "shadowy" 527 groups that run ads for and against Bush and Kerry.

The liberal group MoveOn.org and the anti-Kerry group Swift Boat Veterans for Truth are both 527s, named after a section of the tax code.

But on Friday, a spokeswoman for the Kerry campaign backed away from the suggestion. She said what MoveOn.org is doing is perfectly fine, while what the Swift Boat Veterans are doing is "dishonest" and "dishonorable."

Debra Deshong of the Kerry campaign told Fox News there's a difference between MoveOn.org and Swift Boat Veterans for Truth: "MoveOn.org is an independent organization that existed well before the Kerry campaign," she said, whereas Swift Boat Veterans for Truth "is not an independent group."

Deshong invoked Friday's New York Times article as proof: "And in today's New York Times, it details exactly all the ties this group (Swift Boat Veterans for Truth) has to the Bush White House."

Deshong condemned Bush for not telling Swift Boat Veterans for Truth to stop running their ad. (Swift Boats say it wouldn't matter what Bush said -- see related story)

"Again, we (the Kerry campaign) have nothing to do with these independent ads, like MoveOn.org. That is an independent organization that existed well before the Kerry campaign. They have every right to be running what they are under the campaign finance laws." According to Deshong, "This is about the Swift Boat Vets that are running dishonorable ads that Bush refuses to condemn."

What about the barrage of 527 ads thrown at President Bush? a Bush campaign spokeswoman asked on Friday.

"The fact is, not only has this president had over $62 million dollars spent attacking him by these shadowy groups, but let's not forget about Michael Moore's movie," said Bush campaign spokeswoman Jennifer Millerwise, also speaking on Fox News. She noted that for weeks, Americans could "hardly turn on a TV" without seeing Michael Moore "launch unbelievable attacks on this president."

Millerwise said the Bush campaign would rather focus on the major issues -- including Sen. Kerry's spotty attendance at Senate Intelligence Committee hearings.

Link

My take? Lets eliminate all of these 527s from both campaigns.

[WarC]

Yeah, it's a stinky situation. I don't think we should eliminate them necessarily, but its not like we don't have enough mud slinging as it is.

I believe the old addage "you can't have it both ways" applies to the Kerry campaign here...You just can't expect the Bush campaign to shoot down their 527 buddies when the Kerry campaign won't shoot down theirs. They are theoretically independent, end of story.

Like so much grade school bickering, eh?

[LANMaster]

related story;

FEC reins in 527s, starting next cycle

The Federal Election Commission yesterday voted — starting in the next election cycle — to regulate more of the new brand of political groups known as 527s.
"We have accomplished something significant here," said Commissioner Ellen L. Weintraub, a Democrat, noting that while it may not go as far in regulating 527s as some had wanted, "it's an effort to meet halfway."

The new rule, which goes into effect for the next election cycle, was adopted 4-2, with FEC Chairman Bradley A. Smith, a Republican, joining with Ms. Weintraub and Republican commissioners David M. Mason and Michael E. Toner to support it.
Commissioners Scott E. Thomas and Danny L. McDonald, both Democrats, voted against it.
The tax-exempt "527 groups," which take that name from the section of the tax code that regulates them, seek to influence the selection, nomination, election or appointment of candidates to federal, state or local office — often through unlimited soft money contributions.
Those 527s that have a political action committee are already regulated by the FEC, prompting complaints to the FEC that this unfairly helps those 527s that do not have PACs, but still run ads advocating the defeat of a candidate and collect unlimited money from donors for that purpose.

more

[LANMaster]

WarC

[plschwartz]

The latest ad from the swift boat group selects quotes from Kerry's testimony before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee in 1971 about fellow soldiers. He is seen saying, "They had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads," "randomly shot at civilians," and "razed villages in a fashion reminiscent of Genghis Kahn."
Selected comments

Not shown on the ad is Kerry's preface to those comments, in which he said he is reporting what others said at a conference of Vietnam veterans in Detroit. Instead, a member of the Swift Boat group refers to the statements as "the accusations that John Kerry made against the veterans who served in Vietnam."

[LANMaster]

So who made the comments, and why didn't Kerry name those people at the Senate Foreign Relations Committee April 1971?

Is there a transcript of the Detroit Conference?

[plschwartz]

Originally Posted by LANMaster

So who made the comments, and why didn't Kerry name those people at the Senate Foreign Relations Committee April 1971?

Is there a transcript of the Detroit Conference?

While of course you will question Kerrys statement
I was referring to the Swifties atrributing the statements as his own.
Forget it

[LANMaster]

Okay.

But I agree with you that Kerry (nor anyone else) should be taken out of context by opposing 527's.

My point is that Move on and Moore are just a guilty of taking incomplete statements out of context.

So if Moore repeatedly does it ..... why not the swifties?

[LANMaster]

Seriously, is there a transcript to the Detroit Conference?

[LANMaster]

After some searching I found this. http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Win..._Investigation
I found it somewhat enlightening.

[LANMaster]

Winter soldier list of atrocities.

http://ice.he.net/~freepnet/kerry/in...pic=Atrocities

[flyeater]

Scott Swett is director of the Free Republic Network, sponsor of www.wintersoldier.com. He registered wintersoldier.com on Feb. 12th 2004. Just about the time it was apparent Kerry would be the nominee. Swett even admits ties to swiftvets

[Davey7549]

I find it particularly interesting when many posted, supported, and ranted about many of Moore's statements, rallied to Moveon's statements, and carried water for false media\individuals statements (Walsh) but yet let the SwiftVets use the same avenues open to 527's all becomes wrong, underhanded and borderline criminal..........
Come on people you have been beat at your own lousy game and it was bound to happen!
Kerry himself has now elevated the swiftvets to stardom and the media will have to investigate a wee bit more and a wee bit higher up than the dirt they been promoting before! We shall see who breaks ranks first to get the story.
Hey what ever happened to Cambodia Xmas 1968! Remember that was seared into our minds but not so good Me thinks!

Dave

[GoneForNow]

Davey...............The other interesting aspect which, at the moment, seems to escape Kerry and his cabal (Bush has been accused of having a cabal so fair play) is the distraction from real campaigning. There is method to the madness that has escaped that Yale trained battled harden mind of Kerry. Now that he has filed a formal complaint he has raised the status of the SwiftVets and made himself look small.

[flyeater]

Why do you make it sound as if this is the first time conservatives have engaged in smear tactics? Remember these are the same guys that acted very un-American toward McCain in 2000. Both parties do it. They use party faithful to whisper in peoples ears in order to keep themselves clean.