[Stoner]

Looks like a backlash?

USAToday

Bush urges end to TV attack ads by outside groups

CRAWFORD, Texas (AP) — President Bush denounced TV ads by outside groups attacking both John Kerry and himself on Monday and called for a halt to all such political efforts.

I think they're bad for the system," he said.

The president made his comments as the Kerry campaign fought back against charges made by an outside group that the Democratic senator had lied about wartime events in Vietnam for which he received five medals.

In a conference call with reporters arranged by aides to the Democratic presidential candidate, Navy swift boat officers Rich McCann, Jim Russell and Rich Baker said Kerry acted honorably and bravely and was well qualified to be the nation's commander in chief.

"He was the most aggressive officer in charge of swift boats," Baker said.

Additionally, crewmate Del Sandusky said at a news conference in Harrisburg, Pa., that he personally witnessed the battle action for which Kerry received Silver and Bronze stars and two of his three Purple Hearts.

"He deserved every one of his medals," Sandusky, a retired computer repairman who drove Kerry's boat for nearly three months.

The attack on Kerry's war record has dominated the presidential campaign in the days since Swift Boat Veterans For Truth began airing its commercial in three states.

With polls suggesting Kerry's standing was beginning to slip — at least among veterans — the Democrat last week called on Bush to call for the ads to be pulled from the air. He also accused Bush of allowing front groups to "do his dirty work."

Bush's campaign heatedly denied any connection with the anti-Kerry group, and called on the Democratic challenger to join the president in a call for all outside groups to pull their ads.

Bush has himself been subjected to a multimillion-dollar barrage of attack ads aired by groups seeking to help Kerry win the White House.

[Ciberblade]

He does the right thing...

CRAWFORD, Texas (AP) — President Bush denounced TV ads by outside groups attacking both John Kerry and himself on Monday and called for a halt to all such political efforts.

I think they're bad for the system," he said.

and still you bash, had Kerry denouce the ad's - you wouldn't even question?

[angelize56]

I honestly think people are getting sick of hearing about the boat, about Vietnam, about Bush-n-Kerry getting upset with each other! Let it rest and get on to the real issues in this race!

Bush: Time To Sink Swift Boat Ads
Aug. 23, 2004

(CBS/AP) President Bush on Monday denounced a television advertisement attacking John Kerry's war record and called for a halt to all such political ads by outside groups.

Mr. Bush said he doesn't think there ought to be any unregulated groups involved in the political discourse.

"That means that ad and every other ad," he said. "I think they're bad for the system."

He was referring specifically to an ad sponsored by Swift Boat Veterans for Truth that said Kerry didn't deserve his Purple Hearts, lied to get his Bronze Star and Silver Star, wasn't fighting in neutral Cambodia as he said he was and that he unfairly branded all veterans with his 1971 congressional testimony about atrocities in Vietnam.

The president made his comments as the Kerry campaign fought back against charges made by an outside group that the Democratic senator had lied about wartime events in Vietnam for which he received five medals.

In a conference call with reporters arranged by aides to the Democratic presidential candidate, Navy swift boat officers Rich McCann, Jim Russell and Rich Baker said Kerry acted honorably and bravely and was well qualified to be the nation's commander in chief.

"He was the most aggressive officer in charge of swift boats," Baker said.

Additionally, crewmate Del Sandusky said at a news conference in Harrisburg, Pa., that he personally witnessed the battle action for which Kerry received Silver and Bronze stars and two of his three Purple Hearts.

"He deserved every one of his medals," Sandusky, a retired computer repairman who drove Kerry's boat for nearly three months.

Also Monday, the Kerry campaign released a new ad accusing Mr. Bush of directing the attack on Kerry through a "front" group. The ad claims it's the same kind of smear campaign Mr. Bush used against Sen. John McCain in the 2000 presidential race, when McCain's Vietnam War record came under attack.

"Bush smeared John McCain four years ago. Now, he's doing it to John Kerry," the announcer in the ad says. "George Bush: Denounce the smear. "Get back to the issues. America deserves better."

The attack on Kerry's war record has dominated the presidential campaign in the days since Swift Boat Veterans For Truth began airing its commercial in three states.

Mr. Bush's campaign heatedly denied any connection with the anti-Kerry group, and called on the Democratic challenger to join the president in a call for all outside groups to pull their ads.

Mr. Bush has himself been subjected to a multimillion-dollar barrage of attack ads aired by groups seeking to help Kerry win the White House.

Separately, former GOP presidential candidate Bob Dole, who was seriously wounded in World War II, joined the battle over the weekend. Dole said Kerry received an early exit from combat for "superficial wounds."

"One day he's saying that we were shooting civilians, cutting off their ears, cutting off their heads, throwing away his medals or his ribbons," Dole said on CNN's "Late Edition." "The next day he's standing there, 'I want to be president because I'm a Vietnam veteran.' Maybe he should apologize to all the other 2.5 million veterans who served. He wasn't the only one in Vietnam."

Kerry spokesman Chad Clanton replied: "It's unfortunate that Senator Dole is making statements that official U.S. Navy records prove false. This is partisan politics, not the truth."

Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, a group funded in part by a top GOP donor in Texas, has been running ads featuring veterans who served in Vietnam at the same time as Kerry and question his wartime record.

At Kerry's urging, a Chicago Tribune editor who commanded one of the swift boats broke his silence, saying Kerry's accounts are accurate, and Kerry's critics' versions are wrong. The man steering Kerry's boat during a key incident also backs Kerry's account.

"The critics have taken pains to say they're not trying to cast doubts on the merit of what others did, but their version of events has splashed doubt on all of us," William Rood said in a 1,700-word first-person account published in Sunday's edition of the Tribune. "It's gotten harder and harder for those of us who were there to listen to accounts we know to be untrue, especially when they come from people who were not there."

Rood said the allegations that Kerry's accomplishments were overblown are untrue and that Kerry came up with an attack strategy that was praised by their superiors. According to the Tribune, Rood's recollection of what happened that day in South Vietnam was backed by military documents.

Kerry also picked up support from Wayne D. Langhofer, who told the Washington Post he was manning a machine gun in a boat behind Kerry's and saw firing from both banks of a river as Kerry dived in to rescue Special Forces soldier James Rassmann, the basis for Kerry's Bronze Star.

[Stoner]

Originally Posted by ciberblade

He does the right thing...

and still you bash, had Kerry denouce the ad's - you wouldn't even question?

Of course I bash Bush. Never denied it.
Also never used Moveon or Moore as sources for criticism or information.

I think Bush realized he would have to stop the ads his people started, too many credable witnesses were coming out supporting Kerry's version of events.

Did he do the right thing? yeah, buddy.......under duress That's not the same as 'altruism'.........

[Ciberblade]

Originally Posted by stoner

too many credable witnesses were coming out

Not sure of this, it's all finger pointing and one mans word against another. Kind of like a car accident. The stories are not exactly the same, there is truth on both sides.

If a person say's "that's not what I remember" it does not automatically make them more or less credible.

[Stoner]

Originally Posted by ciberblade

Not sure of this, it's all finger pointing and one mans word against another. Kind of like a car accident. The stories are not exactly the same, there is truth on both sides.

If a person say's "that's not what I remember" it does not automatically make them more or less credible.

Looks to me more of an issue of who was there and who claims to have been there. An issue of witnesses vs politically driven memories.

[Ciberblade]

Originally Posted by Stoner

Looks to me more of an issue of who was there and who claims to have been there. An issue of witnesses vs politically driven memories.

Stoner, I'm sorry to tell you...

They are all politically driven memories

[WarC]

Exactly, Ciber.

What we're seeing happen in this election is just like every election before it, more mud slinging. There is no "Big Poppa Bush and the Republican Bunch" trying to weasel out of something.

I think its high time that Bush and Kerry's campaigns stopped lingering on the Vietnam issue...Knock knock, we aren't in Vietnam anymore...

We have enough issues here and now.

[Ciberblade]

War C ~ the problem there is that Kerry's strength is in Vietnam. Issues are just not present

I still think that Kerry was nominated as a sacrificial lamb - only they underestimated the power of hate, so he is actually doing quite well.

[Stoner]

Originally Posted by ciberblade

Stoner, I'm sorry to tell you...

They are all politically driven memories

Don't feel sorry or guilty

Seems the SB people definitely are politically driven, but not all the actual witnesses are. Actually very few.
Have to disagree on that ciber There have been a number telling the same story as Kerry and there , as yet, been no demonstrated links to political influence.

[LANMaster]

Still waiting for Kerry to denounce Moore, Soros, and Moveon.org, Media Fund, America Coming Together, John Hunting, Peter B. Lewis, and so many others.

room grows silent .... tic ... tic ... tic ... tic

[Ciberblade]

yet...
keep in mind that when the Swift Vets started, there were no links as well. Even the link that was found, only showed a partial picture.

[Infidel_Kastro]

Originally Posted by LANMaster

Still waiting for Kerry to denounce Moore, Soros, and Moveon.org, Media Fund, America Coming Together, John Hunting, Peter B. Lewis, and so many others.

room grows silent .... tic ... tic ... tic ... tic

LAN, I am still waiting for a formal end to the Korean war so get in line,
Beeyatch.

[angelize56]

Hi LAN!

Hi Smilin' Jack!

Swift Boat To Dirty Politics

WASHINGTON, August 23, 2004

(CBS) Well, here we go again.

Just when we needed a campaign about serious issues -- and for a minute there, it looked as if we might get one -- along comes the Swift Boat crowd and their charges that John Kerry didn't deserve the medals he won for valor under fire in Vietnam.

Never mind that the accusers can't quite seem to get their stories straight; negative television commercials are powerful things and the polls suggest the allegations have caused Kerry's support among veterans to slip.

So now Kerry is regrouping to counterattack. He's rolling out his retired military people to argue with the Bush military brigade or, as I understand it, Bush supporters who have no connection to the Bush campaign.

You can make the argument that since Kerry chose to flaunt record his military record, that record is fair game.

But I find the whole thing insulting to the rest of us, just as I found it insulting when some Democrats who, as I understand it, support Kerry but have no connection to the Kerry campaign tried to steer that campaign away from real issues to focus instead on George Bush's attendance record during his long-ago days in the National Guard.

Remember this: George Bush spent enough time in the National Guard to learn to fly a jet plane. And Kerry volunteered to fight in a shooting war. Can't we just let it go at that and get on to talking about something that matters? (See...someone agrees with me! )

We're a country at war, and our military is stretched thin. And we need to know how these two men propose to deal with that -- not who did what in Vietnam. We know how that came out.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/...in636333.shtml

[Stoner]

Hi Sparky