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Medical care versus you and your insurance company


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Stoner's Avatar
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Join Date: Oct 2002
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16-Apr-2005, 05:23 PM #1
Medical care versus you and your insurance company
I just read the following article which appeared in the American Motorcyclist Magazine.
Although the focus is naturally to the concerns of m/cycle riders....the concern of the situation is there for everyone.
What happens when the patient's insurance company authorizes a payment to a hospital that it has prior contractual agreements with, but the hospital wants a piece of the accident settlement to cover the discount it normally gives the insurance company?.....It refuses payment from the insurance company and puts a lien against the patient's accident settlement, for the full bill.......Florida!
But if it is successful in Florida, expect it to be a nation wide problem for accident patients that win damage claims and hospitals that don't want to live up to their contractual agreements with insurance companies.


This is the article, May 2005 issue. It is a scanned OCR representation, there may be spelling and grammar differences.


Quote:
Jacob Faasse thought he had put the horrific crash behind him and was getting on with his life.
After all, it had been two years since he�d been hit by a van while riding his motorcycle. His life-threatening injuries had kept him in the hospital for a month, but Faasse knew he had medical insurance, so he figured everything would be OK.
He figured wrong.
Now, years later, the hospital is telling him he has to pay his outstanding medical bills himself, refusing to accept payment from his insurance company.
The horror started in January 2003, when Faasse, now 59, was hit in Fort Myers, Florida, by a van that made a left turn just 10 feet in front of his 1982 Honda Gold Wing.
Faasse, a school teacher at the time, suffered cardiac arrest, respiratory failure, a shattered left wrist, a compound fracture of the right leg, a crushed throat and other trauma.
It�s a miracle he survived.
Faasse spent a month in the hospital, then went through a long recovery process. During the ordeal, his injuries forced him to retire from his job.
He has high praise for the doctors who saved his life and for the care he received at Lee Memorial Hospital. And he sincerely wants all his medical bills to be paid.
In fact, he says, the doctors filed for payment from his insurance company and have been paid. But the hospital refuses to follow that course.
Instead, the hospital
wants a piece of the settlement that Faasse received from the van driver in the crash.
Why would a hospital turn down payment from an insurance company and go after the patient instead? Simple�the hospital wants more money.
Lee Memorial Health System�s contract with Faasse�s insurance company provides for caps on payments for various services. So if the hospital sends the bills to the insurance company, those limits would apply.
But if Faasse himself has to pay the bills, there are no limits, and the hospital is free to charge substantially more.
In their effort to get those higher payments, hospital officials have simply refused to send Faasse�s bills to his insurance company, which is prepared to pay the claim. Instead, they have filed liens for more than $143,000 against the settlement Faasse received. As a result, that money is now tied up in escrow.
And incredibly, that has left Faasse in the position of having to file a lawsuit against the hospital to force it to accept insurance payment for his bills.
Faasse�s suit notes that although the Florida Legislature gave Lee Memorial Health System the power to file liens so it could collect payment from patients, it allows that only in cases where those patients don�t have medical insurance to pay their bills. And he says the hospital is abusing its power, because Faasse has insurance.
�They have a right to put a lien on me,� Faasse says, �but not to refuse the insurance payment.�
You may be thinking that this can�t happen. Surely, it�s just some mistake. But if it is, it�s a mistake this same hospital has made a number of times.
In late February Scott Whitaker, 29, who was injured in a car crash in September 2003, filed a lawsuit against Lee Memorial Health System after the hospital placed a $37,328 lien against Whitaker�s uninsured motorist insurance policies.
In another case, Tiffany Giddes, 22, of Fort Myers, received a settlement as a result of a 2001 car crash that left her forced to use a wheelchair for mobility. The hospital has filed $99,790 in liens against the settlement rather than seek payment from her insurance company.
Wbitaker hopes to turn his lawsuit into a class-action suit on behalf of patients. That lawsuit seeks to force the hospital to honor the agreements it has signed with insurance companies, rather than seeking higher payments directly from victims.
�Lee Memorial is taking money (it�s) not entitled to, and that�s money out of the patient�s pocket,� Whitaker�s lawyer, Joseph Fuller, told the Fort Myers News-Press.
The hospital, however, defends its actions.
Regarding the Faasse case, Robert McCurdy, the hospital�s vice president for legal services, told the News-Press:
�The amount of money that�s available through health insurance oftentimes is far less than the total amount of the bill. The question is, should Lee Memorial be entitled to recover the money it�s spent on this gentleman?�
Faasse sees his lawsuit as the only way he can make sure the hospital gets paid, the liens get removed and he can �get on with my life.�
But he has some advice for motorcyclists and their families who may find themselves in the hospital being badgered to sign legal documents: Don�t sign anything without reviewing the documents with a lawyer.
Hospital officials, he says, �wanted my wife to sign papers that said if I didn�t pay the bills, they could go after her.�
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Mulderator's Avatar
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16-Apr-2005, 06:18 PM #2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoner
I just read the following article which appeared in the American Motorcyclist Magazine.
Although the focus is naturally to the concerns of m/cycle riders....the concern of the situation is there for everyone.
What happens when the patient's insurance company authorizes a payment to a hospital that it has prior contractual agreements with, but the hospital wants a piece of the accident settlement to cover the discount it normally gives the insurance company?.....It refuses payment from the insurance company and puts a lien against the patient's accident settlement, for the full bill.......Florida!
But if it is successful in Florida, expect it to be a nation wide problem for accident patients that win damage claims and hospitals that don't want to live up to their contractual agreements with insurance companies.

.
In California, they can't do that. A Plaintiff is limited to recovering only that portion of medical expenses his insurance company pay the healthcare provider under contract and the healthcare provider is limited to collecting from its patient only that which the patient's insurance company has negotiated to pay with the healthcare provider.

Some plaintiff attorneys tell their patients not to submit bills to the insurance company for that very reason because they want to introduce the entire amount of the bill (not the discounted amount) as evidence at trial because they get more money that way. The problem is that if you do that, the defendant should be permitted to then comment on the fact that you had insurance and didn't submit the bills (normally insurance coverage is not admissalbe at trial so as not to prejudice the Plaintiff from recoverying his medical expenses) to demonstrate that you are deliberately attempting to inflate the claim.

I don't see this as a problem--most states follow California and I would expect common sense in most states will prevail and legislators or courts will stop healthcare providers or plaintiffs from trying to manipulate the system for financial gain.
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GoneForNow's Avatar
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16-Apr-2005, 06:30 PM #3
Wouldn't fly in my state and many other states I'm aware of as well. Most health insurance contracts that I have seen require the hospital to accept as payment the amount agreed upon by the two parties and not bill the insured for the difference. The insured (that would be you and me) are third party beneficiaries of the contract between the insurance company and the hospital and as such we can enforce the terms of the agreement against the hospital as if we are the insurance company.
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Stoner's Avatar
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16-Apr-2005, 07:42 PM #4
GB, Mulder.....what makes Florida unique, or is it a testing ground to see if it is a concept the hospitals can persue in other states?


Is this even legal in Florida??
Mulderator's Avatar
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16-Apr-2005, 08:31 PM #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoner
GB, Mulder.....what makes Florida unique, or is it a testing ground to see if it is a concept the hospitals can persue in other states?


Is this even legal in Florida??
Because the people in Florida are Moore-Ons!
Stoner's Avatar
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16-Apr-2005, 08:32 PM #6
Lol!!...........
LuckyStrike's Avatar
Computer Specs
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17-Apr-2005, 01:21 AM #7
I would think that the insured would possibly have a cause of action not just against the hospital, but especially against the insurance company if the contractual limits of the medical policy in force covered the hospital's charges. If I had an insurance policy that covered, lets say up to $250,000 in hospital charges, but the hospital put a lien on my assets because the hospital wanted $140,000 but their agreement with the insurance company limited the charges for the care I received to $100,000, then I think I would have a cause of action against the insurance company for breach of faith. I would enforce my contract with the insurance company, and let them enforce their contract with the hospital. But then I am not a lawyer.
Wino's Avatar
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17-Apr-2005, 10:06 AM #8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mulder
Because the people in Florida are Moore-Ons!
Any state that elected two Bushes to office certainly has an over abundance of morons as residents. In fact, massive morons would apply to any RED state.
GoneForNow's Avatar
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17-Apr-2005, 01:00 PM #9
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wino
Any state that elected two Bushes to office certainly has an over abundance of morons as residents. In fact, massive morons would apply to any RED state.
And how many times did Texas elect Bush both as governor and president? BTW, the BS that it wasn't real Texans doesn't hold, too many votes, real Texans (as you call them) had to have voted for Bush. So how does it feel to be a minority gringo?
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The Democrats laughed. "I was talking about the minimum wage," Pelosi said. "The American people sent a message this past election, and that message was that they wanted their government to pretend there is no terrorist problem and instead focus on inane crap and entitlements... and who better to do that than we Democrats?"
bassetman's Avatar
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18-Apr-2005, 03:03 AM #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mulder
Because the people in Florida are Moore-Ons!
I like the people there, but you may have a point!
Wino's Avatar
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18-Apr-2005, 08:34 AM #11
Quote:
Originally Posted by gbrumb
And how many times did Texas elect Bush both as governor and president? BTW, the BS that it wasn't real Texans doesn't hold, too many votes, real Texans (as you call them) had to have voted for Bush. So how does it feel to be a minority gringo?
Feels the same as it always has.............frustrating to know that Texans continue to dumb down, caused by the carpetbagging interbreeding with the populace.

BTW, next you trip to Hawaii, suggest you drive.
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