There's no such thing as a stupid question, but they're the easiest to answer.
JoinTour
Login
Search
Civilized Debate
Tag Cloud
access acer asus bios bsod computer crash driver drivers error ethernet excel freeze gaming gpu hard drive hardware hdmi internet laptop malware memory missing monitor motherboard music network obp printer problem ram registry router slow software sound trojan ubuntu 11.10 uninstall usb video virus vista wifi windows windows 7 windows 7 32 bit windows 7 64 bit windows xp wireless
Search
Search for:
Tech Support Guy Forums > Community > Controversial Topics > Civilized Debate >
Gap between rich and poor growing in the US

 
Thread Tools
poochee's Avatar
Computer Specs
Distinguished Member with 86,675 posts.
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: California
Experience: Intermediate
01-Apr-2006, 04:32 PM #781
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mulder
Problem is liberals don't now how to think rationally about the issues. For example, there are few very good looking people--far more are average or ugly. The liberals answer to that issue is to scar up the good looking severely and to a lesser extent the average so that everyone is equally ugly.
That is one of the most off-the-wall examples I have ever heard to explain the gap between the rich and the poor!

I got my laugh of the day.
Mulderator's Avatar
Distinguished Member with 51,004 posts.
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
01-Apr-2006, 04:40 PM #782
Take a look at this site:

http://freedomkeys.com/gap.htm

which explains it mathematically. And take a look at this chart:



Quote:
As Robert A. Heinlein said, "Throughout history, poverty is the normal condition of man. Advances which permit this norm to be exceeded -- here and there, now and then -- are the work of an extremely small minority, frequently despised, often condemned, and almost always opposed by all right thinking people. Whenever this tiny minority is kept from creating or (as sometimes happens) is driven out of a society, the people then slip back into abject poverty."
These are the bassetmans, the champs, the Linskys, the Xicos, the Reps--the liberals. I don't know that they really believe by punishing the rich, they will help the poor--certainly all of the objective data says that is not true--that by punishing the rich the poor will suffer as well (and it fact--just look at the chart--the gap has been widening for a long time but as the rich get richer, so do the poor). Sometimes, the people simply can't comprehend or refuse to look at the objective data--like poochee who thinks that riasing the minimum wage will help the poor when virtually every study done--many at liberal universities shows the poor are actually hurt by raises in minimum wage.

So my point is these people call me and Gbrumb and Ciber and LAN and Bill.amm and those of us that have actually taken the time to think this through rationally and look at the data as selfish when in reality, there is nothing more I would love to see than there to be no poor because that makes it better for all of us. But we won't get there by taxing the rich more. Its those of us who are not rich, but yet can separate our emotions and our envy to do what's best for the country regardless of our personal feelings. Liberals can't separate their emotions to take a look at the logic and facts--its that simple.
__________________
Weapon of Mass Instruction!
bassetman's Avatar
Computer Specs
Moderator - Gone but never forgotten with 48,307 posts.
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Great White North (WI)
Experience: Getting somewhere I hope
01-Apr-2006, 04:41 PM #783
Quote:
Originally Posted by poochee
That is one of the most off-the-wall examples I have ever heard to explain the gap between the rich and the poor!

I got my laugh of the day.
It is, isn't it!?
Mulderator's Avatar
Distinguished Member with 51,004 posts.
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
01-Apr-2006, 04:52 PM #784
Quote:
Originally Posted by poochee
That is one of the most off-the-wall examples I have ever heard to explain the gap between the rich and the poor!

I got my laugh of the day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassetman
It is, isn't it!?
LOL! Well, here we have two of our liberal mental midgets of economics!

Uhhh--the example wasn't to explain the gap between rich and poor it was to explain the irrational thinking of liberals--a point you two make nicely for me! Thank you!
poochee's Avatar
Computer Specs
Distinguished Member with 86,675 posts.
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: California
Experience: Intermediate
01-Apr-2006, 04:55 PM #785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mulder
LOL! Well, here we have two of our liberal mental midgets of economics!

Uhhh--the example wasn't to explain the gap between rich and poor it was to explain the irrational thinking of liberals--a point you two make nicely for me! Thank you!
A veeeeeeeeeeery poor opening statement for a lawyer!
Mulderator's Avatar
Distinguished Member with 51,004 posts.
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
01-Apr-2006, 05:01 PM #786
Quote:
Originally Posted by poochee
A veeeeeeeeeeery poor opening statement for a lawyer!
It was a closing argument!
poochee's Avatar
Computer Specs
Distinguished Member with 86,675 posts.
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: California
Experience: Intermediate
01-Apr-2006, 05:09 PM #787
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mulder
It was a closing argument!
Looked like an "opener" to me....the first thing I read and then laughed and laughed!

You lose.....
bassetman's Avatar
Computer Specs
Moderator - Gone but never forgotten with 48,307 posts.
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Great White North (WI)
Experience: Getting somewhere I hope
01-Apr-2006, 05:33 PM #788
Quote:
Originally Posted by poochee
Looked like an "opener" to me....the first thing I read and then laughed and laughed!

You lose.....

"When you're a law student, they tell you that if you can't argue the law, argue the facts. They also tell you if you can't argue the facts, argue the law. If you can't argue either, apparently, the solution is to go on a public relations offensive and make it a political issue... to say over and over again "it's lawful", and to think that the American people will somehow come to believe this if we say it often enough.


Guess which one Mulder is doing?
__________________
Bush on 911.....What Rice and Powell said about WMDs!.....Learn about Human Rights
..."Blessed is the man, who having nothing to say, abstains from giving wordy evidence of the fact."
-George Eliot (1819-1880), author.
GoneForNow's Avatar
Distinguished Member with 12,503 posts.
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
01-Apr-2006, 05:49 PM #789
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassetman
"When you're a law student, they tell you that if you can't argue the law, argue the facts. They also tell you if you can't argue the facts, argue the law. If you can't argue either, apparently, the solution is to go on a public relations offensive and make it a political issue... to say over and over again "it's lawful", and to think that the American people will somehow come to believe this if we say it often enough.


Guess which one Mulder is doing?
Actually its: If you can't argue the facts argue the law. If you can't argue the law argue the facts.
My addition is: If you can't argue either, confuse the judge.
bassetman's Avatar
Computer Specs
Moderator - Gone but never forgotten with 48,307 posts.
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Great White North (WI)
Experience: Getting somewhere I hope
01-Apr-2006, 05:51 PM #790
Quote:
Originally Posted by gbrumb
Actually its: If you can't argue the facts argue the law. If you can't argue the law argue the facts.
My addition is: If you can't argue either, confuse the judge.

Whatever works at the time!
poochee's Avatar
Computer Specs
Distinguished Member with 86,675 posts.
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: California
Experience: Intermediate
01-Apr-2006, 09:39 PM #791
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassetman
"When you're a law student, they tell you that if you can't argue the law, argue the facts. They also tell you if you can't argue the facts, argue the law. If you can't argue either, apparently, the solution is to go on a public relations offensive and make it a political issue... to say over and over again "it's lawful", and to think that the American people will somehow come to believe this if we say it often enough.

Guess which one Mulder is doing?
xico's Avatar
Distinguished Member with 29,958 posts.
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Venice, FL
Experience: Intermediate
02-Apr-2006, 01:24 AM #792
America's new FAST Track to Fascism

Every day on national cable, Lou Dobbs curses the steady flow of desperate migrant workers who cross our borders, laboring in exchange for increasingly worthless dollars. Meanwhile, under the radar, Goldman Sachs gives new meaning to the term "highway robbery" by facilitating the massive flow of foreign capital in exchange for American highways.

If somebody asked if you wanted to buy the Brooklyn Bridge, you’d know it was a con. But how about buying the Indiana Toll Road?

Before you snicker, you should know the Indiana highway was auctioned off last week for $3.8 billion.

For the next 75 years, the more than 150 miles of Interstate 80 will be run by a pair of Spanish and Australian companies that will collect the tolls, operate the pit stops, keep up the highway and try to make a profit.

For the full article (which is absolutely amazing!), click here.

Next it will be our sidewalks!

Actually, we don't even own our homes. We rent them from the government, and if we don't pay the rent, they sell'em right out under us.
__________________
If any man tells you he loves America, yet hates labor, he is a liar" - Abraham Lincoln
bassetman's Avatar
Computer Specs
Moderator - Gone but never forgotten with 48,307 posts.
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Great White North (WI)
Experience: Getting somewhere I hope
02-Apr-2006, 04:22 AM #793
Quote:
Originally Posted by xico
America's new FAST Track to Fascism

Every day on national cable, Lou Dobbs curses the steady flow of desperate migrant workers who cross our borders, laboring in exchange for increasingly worthless dollars. Meanwhile, under the radar, Goldman Sachs gives new meaning to the term "highway robbery" by facilitating the massive flow of foreign capital in exchange for American highways.

If somebody asked if you wanted to buy the Brooklyn Bridge, you’d know it was a con. But how about buying the Indiana Toll Road?

Before you snicker, you should know the Indiana highway was auctioned off last week for $3.8 billion.

For the next 75 years, the more than 150 miles of Interstate 80 will be run by a pair of Spanish and Australian companies that will collect the tolls, operate the pit stops, keep up the highway and try to make a profit.

For the full article (which is absolutely amazing!), click here.

Next it will be our sidewalks!

Actually, we don't even own our homes. We rent them from the government, and if we don't pay the rent, they sell'em right out under us.

I guess after we sold the White House everything else was up for grabs!
Paquadez's Avatar
Community Moderator with 7,947 posts.
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: London UK
02-Apr-2006, 07:13 AM #794
Lightbulb How To!
There is only one way to nail this argument, using statistics.

That is for one of you to produce cogent figures.

Bear in mind that such statistical analysis is invariably flawed. In order for the numbers to have any credibility, at all, income per capita (and per family: two different animals!) has to be corrected (or weighted, as statisticians call it) by the Cost Base.

In other words, for the final comparitive numbers to have any real meaning, the Cost Base has to be adjusted for its impact against the annualised results.

In most Western economies, the Cost Base has increased exponentially (i.e. it cannot be simply graphed, as the curve would turn back on itself) over time, as demands for local and national taxes increases dramatically as government (national, and regional and local) impacts on incomes.

In the UK, for example, the impact of local taxes (Council Tax) on the lower income groups, is a far higher percentage of gross and net incomes than it is on the upper quartile groups.

Thus it a falacious argument to simply lay out lowest, highest and median incomes against time, compare the three curves and reach any conclusion which enjoys validity.

And all else apart, to gain any level of acuracy, it needs at least Lower Quartile, Median and upper quartile curves, as well as highest and lowest data sets.

The endless political argument is also pointless in this hypothesis, as one needs to reach the pure and adjusted (by weighting) data results and thereafter, seek the answers in Cause and Effect terms. Or more simply, if you like, who to blame, or who to congratulate!

Sadly, these days, we live in the age of statistics, where Spin encourages braindead politicans to spout their mantra and blindside the gullible public with endless (and in reality!) meaningless numbers!

As a famous British Prime Minister, Benjamin Disraeli once said, "There are lies, damned lies and statistics". In ascending priority of importance!

Paq
__________________
Retreated To Relative Sanity!


Stoner's Avatar
Account Disabled with 47,328 posts.
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Dayton,Oh
02-Apr-2006, 09:36 AM #795
Good post, Paq.

This thread has been mostly a pissing contest of two polarized viewpoints.
One is to spread the 'wealth', the other is to ignore the situation.
Any reasonable person can view poverty by merely driving thru large sections of most large cities and if they are curious, search out the rural poverty. It's bigger than most think.

Job creation is only beneficial to those that seek it.
Little is done to show the benefits of capitalism to those that know the least about it. The concept of 'enlightened capitalism' seems forgotten in the quest of efficiency, which is defined by profit and profitability.
How can the unemployed benefit from new jobs without the concept of job training?
How can job training be achieved by the contraction of government support of that concept? Of education being a political football? Of education being privatized to the detriment of communities that can least afford reasonable standards? Of Liberals, Conservatives and Unions all competing, with their influence being the foremost consideration, rather than education itself?

It usually takes civil unrest and major rioting along with the destruction of large amounts of private property to bring focus to the existing social problems.
Yes, it's outlaws that create these problems. Untill communities in poverty understand that there are benefits to education and the basic economic system we have, I doubt there will be much more than envy of the wealthy.... other than hatred. They see no means of improving their position in life other than taking what they need.

Spreading the wealth is but a short time bribe till the money runs out and ignoring the situation only works if their communities are barb wired off....

BTW......the Feds are spending faster than collecting. Looks like barb wire to me
 

THIS THREAD HAS EXPIRED.
Are you having the same problem? We have volunteers ready to answer your question, but first you'll have to join for free. Need help getting started? Check out our Welcome Guide.

Search Tech Support Guy

Find the solution to your
computer problem!




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
WELCOME TO TECH SUPPORT GUY! Are you looking for the solution to your computer problem? Join our site today to ask your question -- for free! Our site is run completely by volunteers who want to help you solve your computer problems. See our Welcome Guide to get started.
Thread Tools



Facebook Facebook Twitter Twitter TechGuy.tv TechGuy.tv Mobile TSG Mobile
You Are Using:
Server ID
Advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service.
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:24 PM.
Copyright © 1996 - 2011 TechGuy, Inc. All rights reserved.

Powered by Cermak Technologies, Inc.