[plschwartz]

Rep. Marilyn Musgrave's (R-CO) Republican party event out in Colorado over the weekend.

Here's a photograph from the Larimer County GOP website in which Rep. Musgrave appears to be introducing two Marines at the County GOP political event. (That's how it's described in this article in the local paper.)
thanks to Josh Marshall

[LANMaster]

Looks like these brave Marines are being honored.

I know that must make you and Josh Marshall sick.

Anything that honors the US military must make you and Josh sick to your stomachs. You'd NEVER see this at a Democrat party event.

[peril0us]

There is nothing wrong with honoring marines, assuming they didnt something special; its the military as a whole and the higher up level that is corrupt and we cant stereotype every marine.

[plschwartz]

4. POLICY

It is DoD policy to encourage members of the Armed Forces (hereafter referred to as "members") to carry out the obligations of citizenship. While on active duty, however, members are prohibited from engaging in certain political activities. The following DoD policy shall apply:

4.1. General

4.1.1. A member on active duty may:

4.1.1.1. Register, vote, and express his or her personal opinion on political candidates and issues, but not as a representative of the Armed Forces.

4.1.1.2. Make monetary contributions to a political organization.

4.1.1.3. Attend partisan and nonpartisan political meetings, rallies, or conventions as a spectator when not in uniform.

4.1.2. A member on active duty shall not:

4.1.2.1. Use his or her official authority or influence for interfering with an election; affecting the course or outcome of an election; soliciting votes for a particular candidate or issue; or requiring or soliciting political contributions from others.

4.1.2.2. Be a candidate for, hold, or exercise the functions of civil office except as authorized in paragraphs 4.2. and 4.3., below.

4.1.2.3. Participate in partisan political management, campaigns, or conventions (unless attending a convention as a spectator when not in uniform).
http://www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/c...2/d134410x.htm

A few weeks ago we discussed the fact that the RNC was apparently working with the White House to send active duty members of the military in uniform to speak on behalf of the president's policies at Republican political events. That's against the law and military regulations. And for good reason since that's a quick ride to making the military -- or factions or individuals in the military -- tools of one or the other political party.

Marshall

Bush opened the door by making so many political speeches in front of active military
units. This now is the second step. Does having the military involverd in the political process bother you?
What if there were 100 marines there, a thousand. What if they were aarmed? Would you be bothered by the military as a whole supporting a candidate?

Slippery slope

[bassetman]

I saw that right away. A Colonel got in trouble here for attending a Bush rally in uniform.

[Mulderator]

Originally Posted by bassetman

I saw that right away. A Colonel got in trouble here for attending a Bush rally in uniform.

Got in trouble from who? You and your leftist hack buddies. You people would probably prefer to have Abu Ghraib prisoners at your political rallies!

BTW--deliberately lying to make Bush look bad may not be against the law, but it certainly is unethical--that doesn't seem to bother you or Schwartz very much! I have a hard time taking an ethical lesson from you two!

[bassetman]

Originally Posted by Mulder

Got in trouble from who? You and your leftist hack buddies. You people would probably prefer to have Abu Ghraib prisoners at your political rallies!

BTW--deliberately lying to make Bush look bad may not be against the law, but it certainly is unethical--that doesn't seem to bother you or Schwartz very much! I have a hard time taking an ethical lesson from you two!

Published - Wednesday, June 09, 2004

Former JAG calls for Fort McCoy's commander's removal

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By REID MAGNEY, La Crosse Tribune

.
A civilian Army lawyer is calling on the Pentagon to remove Fort McCoy's garrison commander for improper involvement in President Bush's La Crosse campaign rally.

Col. Danny Nobles "needs to be removed from command immediately," said attorney Al Novotne, Fort McCoy's ethics counselor. "He's free to resign or retire and get involved in politics, but not while having troops under his command."

Novotne, a retired Army major and a former judge advocate general (JAG), said he's speaking out as a private citizen, not on behalf of the Army.

A group called Coulee Region Concerned Citizens filed a complaint with the Army about the involvement of soldiers in Bush's political rally May 7 at Copeland Park. The group also complained Nobles attended the rally in his Army uniform.

The group has also asked for an investigation into whether the fort's civilian executive officer, Al Fournier, attended the Bush rally on official time, which could be a violation of the Hatch Act.

The Army needs "to send the message that we don't endorse political candidates," Novotne said.

The complaints are under review by the U.S. Army Reserve Command, "so it's inappropriate to comment at this time," Fort McCoy spokeswoman Linda Fournier said Monday.

She said Nobles and Al Fournier would have no comment on the matter. The Fourniers are husband and wife.

...http://www.lacrossetribune.com/artic...ews/01lead.txt

I heard him speak a week later and he stopped just short of saying "vote Bush" while in uniform.

[Mulderator]

Originally Posted by bassetman

Published - Wednesday, June 09, 2004

Former JAG calls for Fort McCoy's commander's removal

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Downtown Dental

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By REID MAGNEY, La Crosse Tribune

.
A civilian Army lawyer is calling on the Pentagon to remove Fort McCoy's garrison commander for improper involvement in President Bush's La Crosse campaign rally.

Col. Danny Nobles "needs to be removed from command immediately," said attorney Al Novotne, Fort McCoy's ethics counselor. "He's free to resign or retire and get involved in politics, but not while having troops under his command."

Novotne, a retired Army major and a former judge advocate general (JAG), said he's speaking out as a private citizen, not on behalf of the Army.

A group called Coulee Region Concerned Citizens filed a complaint with the Army about the involvement of soldiers in Bush's political rally May 7 at Copeland Park. The group also complained Nobles attended the rally in his Army uniform.

The group has also asked for an investigation into whether the fort's civilian executive officer, Al Fournier, attended the Bush rally on official time, which could be a violation of the Hatch Act.

The Army needs "to send the message that we don't endorse political candidates," Novotne said.

The complaints are under review by the U.S. Army Reserve Command, "so it's inappropriate to comment at this time," Fort McCoy spokeswoman Linda Fournier said Monday.

She said Nobles and Al Fournier would have no comment on the matter. The Fourniers are husband and wife.

...http://www.lacrossetribune.com/artic...ews/01lead.txt

I heard him speak a week later and he stopped just short of saying "vote Bush" while in uniform.

Typical--cover your own hypocrisy with a cut and paste.

[bassetman]

Originally Posted by Mulder

Typical--cover your own hypocrisy with a cut and paste.

Your typical denial of facts.

My father, a retired CPO from USN was the first to point out the violation to me.

[Mulderator]

Originally Posted by bassetman

Your typical denial of facts.

My father, a retired CPO from USN was the first to point out the violation to me.

What about the fact the AP lied to disparage Bush. Why have you got no ethical problem with that? Why does Schwartz have no ethical problem? Everyone now agrees the AP story was a phony, yet I don't see you two recant your positions.

My point is neither you nor Schwartz have any business questioning anyone else ethics--about anything.

[bassetman]

Military personnel may attend events where the president is appearing as the president, "but not as a candidate," Conrad said. "They may not appear to be endorsing or be on the speaker's podium. They may not be on official time."

Conrad said military punishments for violating the rules against political involvement can range from letters of reprimand to court-martial, though a court-martial is rare.

BTW He was on stage with Bush!

[bassetman]

Originally Posted by Mulder

What about the fact the AP lied to disparage Bush. Why have you got no ethical problem with that? Why does Schwartz have no ethical problem? Everyone now agrees the AP story was a phony, yet I don't see you two recant your positions.

My point is neither you nor Schwartz have any business questioning anyone else ethics--about anything.

You changed the subject, and I'm not following you there.

[linskyjack]

Mulder, thats a pretty flimsy argument (and I think its a logical error). What is in question is not whether or not Schwartz or Bassetman have an "ethical problem" but whether or not this group is not guilty of flaunting military protocols and rules. It's obvious that they are. Why should this shock you. In order to sell this war, the modus operandi is to portray those who disagree with it as anti-military (talk about a lack of ethics) and to use every jingoistic American symbol they can to push this message home.

[Rollin' Rog]

Mulder's technique has become abundantly clear: it is to hijack every thread that contains viewpoints contrary to his own by turning it into a debate about something other than the posted topic.

[plschwartz]

Gentlemen:
Some time ago I tried to separate Mulder the mod from Mulder the poster. It didn't last. So now you cannot ignore him. He is like some some guy in a boomboxcar playing rap that is going around your neighborhood at four AM. You can't shut it out.the only thing
So I can do is not to respond to him at alld
He also does remind me of a friends dog whom wont sit and never tires of coming to you and smelling your crotch And to get noticed.
He of course seldom cares about content.Rather it is the game of irratating you and interrupting ongoing dialogs
I invite you to join me to 86 Mulder by plain ignoring him til he gets some manners back.