[iltos]

Originally Posted by katonca

I'm not sure where the disagreement is. Free will is fine (it's what alot of religions are based on - mine also) but that doesn't mean rules are not in place for you to follow. As an example, the law says you stop at a red light but since there isn't anyone/anything stopping you from going through the light, you exercise free will and do. The law is clear, that's a $36.72 fine when caught. The law is also clear as it pertains to religious commandments. Break the law and blessings associated with keeping that commandment are withheld.

Maybe I misread something....if I did, my apologies

i dunno if you and i have a disagreement or not, katonca....i'm still trying to illustrate my answer to your question -why, in general, i see a difference between religious leaders with a conservative philosophy and those with a liberal philosophy

to me, it has something to do with their respective attitudes towards free will....i only quoted your smilie as a jumping off point as to where that difference in attitudes may be coming from.....the fact that, imo, liberal theologians are more willing to allow me to make choices is not the same thing as saying they believe that abortion, for example, is condoned by god....what it says to me is that their teachings apply to everyone, and that god's plan only has the laws you hold in such high regard when people approach them through their own free will

i mean..it's obvious that a gay atheist isn't gonna care much what a preacher says who condemns his life as sinful because it doesn't pass the preacher's litmus test....fact is, it will probably only cement his view that it's all pretty silly....a theologian who welcomes him as a child of god, without judgement re: how that gay atheist is using his free will, stands a much better chance of bringing that person closer to a christain god.

i would think for both types of religious leaders, it would be a tough job....

[katonca]

Originally Posted by poochee

Your post was not offensive.

I'll put my two cents worth in here.

In the past, I have been royally harassed because I am a Christian Democrat and was labeled as a liberal. (Harassment will only cement my opinion).

But to the close minded you can't be a Christian because of certain issues. One of them being abortion. As far as abortion is concerned, IMO, it has always been here and, sadly, always will be due to the life styles some people live, both men and women. And those people in the closet that won't tell you they are pro-choice. I prefer to use my energy on other issues where something may be accomplished. I now proudly carry the label of "liberal".

Hi poochee

Abortion has always been a sore spot with me. I'll bet my last dollar that if by a miracle abortion would be abolished and eliminated, you'd be tickled pink

It's those who don't value life (of the unborn) and would say elimination of abortion is a travesty, are the folks that back me cringe.

[katonca]

Originally Posted by iltos

i mean..it's obvious that a gay atheist isn't gonna care much what a preacher says who condemns his life as sinful because it doesn't pass the preacher's litmus test....fact is, it will probably only cement his view that it's all pretty silly....a theologian who welcomes him as a child of god, without judgement re: how that gay atheist is using his free will, stands a much better chance of bring that person closer to a christain god.

i would think for both types of religious leaders, it would be a tough job....

Any religious leader should be willing and anxious to help those who break the commandments.

To tell you the truth, I maybe be living in a conservative box. I don't know or ever heard preach, a "liberal" minister. To tell you the truth, that's just fine with me.

[Stoner]

Originally Posted by katonca

.....................

To tell you the truth, I maybe be living in a conservative box. ....................................................

That you may be, but this thread didn't seem intended to address conservatives.
I believe LJ was posting to neoconservatives.
The thread title is a tip off.
I see you avoided my question before, but I'll ask again....are you a neoconservative?

[poochee]

Originally Posted by katonca

Hi poochee

Abortion has always been a sore spot with me. I'll bet my last dollar that if by a miracle abortion would be abolished and eliminated, you'd be tickled pink

It's those who don't value life (of the unborn) and would say elimination of abortion is a travesty, are the folks that back me cringe.

Yep, I am anti-abortion (except in rare cases), but as I said lifestyle is the cause.

[poochee]

Originally Posted by katonca

Any religious leader should be willing and anxious to help those who break the commandments.

To tell you the truth, I maybe be living in a conservative box. I don't know or ever heard preach, a "liberal" minister. To tell you the truth, that's just fine with me.

A church that has a woman minister is liberal. Not Biblical. In fact, I left a church because of that.

[iltos]

Originally Posted by katonca

To tell you the truth, that's just fine with me.

i know...and i respect that
but here's your back at ya, anyway

[katonca]

Originally Posted by Stoner

That you may be, but this thread didn't seem intended to address conservatives.
I believe LJ was posting to neoconservatives.
The thread title is a tip off.
I see you avoided my question before, but I'll ask again....are you a neoconservative?

One thing you can bet your last dollar on, I don't avoid questions....guaranteed.

I had to look up the term in the encyclopedia and see what the notion is behind the term. From what I read, I don't disagree with the ideas I read. Is that a yes? I guess it is and I don't see anything anti-Christian concerning the beliefs.

[katonca]

Originally Posted by poochee

A church that has a woman minister is liberal. Not Biblical. In fact, I left a church because of that.

Thanks poochee

[katonca]

Originally Posted by iltos

i know...and i respect that
but here's your back at ya, anyway

Thanks iltos, I'll put it in my box. I hope I didn't offend you with any of my comments......it was not my intention if so.

[iltos]

Originally Posted by katonca

Thanks iltos, I'll put it in my box. I hope I didn't offend you with any of my comments......it was not my intention if so.

not offended a bit, katonca...tho i was surprised by the resisitance to the idea i was offering up..... (i was raised a christain scientist....i came out of it with two things....god is love, and doctors are good )

i figure, tho, that if i put an ohm meter on that box, i'd find a lot of resistance

fortunately, i don't believe that "resistance is futile"

[~Candy~]

Originally Posted by katonca

I think it's only fair to ask the same question of those liberals on the fringe (or just left of center). Those who believe in partial-birth abortion, homosexuality, removal of any recognition of Christianity from public land, allowance for porn in the children section of public libraries (my all time favorite liberal notion ). Can they too be recognized as being "Christian" just because they talk the talk?


Not

I'm not a liberal, but, I must wonder how homosexuality would affect you? Or anyone for that matter

[~Candy~]

Originally Posted by poochee

A church that has a woman minister is liberal. Not Biblical. In fact, I left a church because of that.

Can you please explain that logic or reasoning to me?

[~Candy~]

Originally Posted by katonca

Hi poochee

Abortion has always been a sore spot with me. I'll bet my last dollar that if by a miracle abortion would be abolished and eliminated, you'd be tickled pink

It's those who don't value life (of the unborn) and would say elimination of abortion is a travesty, are the folks that back me cringe.

The schools need to have the freedom or right, or whatever you wish to call it, to teach sexual education. Some parents are very opposed to that, as little Johnny or little Jenny can't be exposed to that

Once they discover it on their own, then, we are left with unwanted pregnancies or forcing children to have babies.

[poochee]

Originally Posted by AcaCandy

Can you please explain that logic or reasoning to me?

A man is to be the head of a church.