[ekim68]

Interesting that a lot of TV commercials during prime time around her are for big trucks that look like tanks...

[selectrick]

Originally Posted by ekim68

As an aside, I read about Toyota wanting to put a plant in Tenn. a couple of years ago and the state was promising all kinds of things to attract it.
They would give 5 to 10 years of tax relief, and rezone the land, etc. But, in the end, Toyota chose Canada because of health care costs in the U.S.

I read part of the reason Toyota chose Canada was that workers in the south were too close to illiterate, but here's some more detail:http://guerillawomentn.blogspot.com/...us-better.html

[ekim68]

Interesting, thank you selectrick..

[bassetman]

Originally Posted by selectrick

I read part of the reason Toyota chose Canada was that workers in the south were too close to illiterate, but here's some more detail:http://guerillawomentn.blogspot.com/...us-better.html

Good news for LANMaster!

[Stoner]

As much as I harp on Lanmaster about using bogus bloggers, I would have thought some of the other members would have caught on.

Canada doesn't look in such great shape either:
http://www.hrsdc.gc.ca/en/hip/lld/nl.../10_fact.shtml

excerpt>

Overall, Canada performs well internationally on measures of education and skill. Nonetheless, many adult Canadians lack literacy and other essential skill competencies required for full participation in the global economy and society.
In Canada, 58% of working age adults (aged 16 to 65) scored at level 3 or higher. Level 3 is the minimum level required to succeed in the knowledge-based economy.

But go back to the source the blog site was referencing:
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07/25/op...25krugman.html
Here's the real issue in the last lines.............it's an argument for socialism:

For now, let me just point out that treating people decently is sometimes a competitive advantage. In America, basic health insurance is a privilege; in Canada, it's a right. And in the auto industry, at least, the good jobs are heading north.

It's one less major issue Toyota would have to face in Canada with the unions there....the Canadian tax payer picks up the tab on health coverage, not Toyota.

[LANMaster]

Originally Posted by LuckyStrike

Lan,
You obviously have never worked as a full time hourly worker in a factory for any length of time. I can tell you that an hourly workforce are typically good people and good workers. The slackers or problem children are the exception.

12 years at a medium-sized corporation hourly, in the factory. (non union)

In thirteen years I saw four plant managers. Two of them were outstanding, one was mediocre, one was a petty, immature, adulterous, slime bag dud. Good workers want to support their families, build a retirement. If hourly workers quit every time they meet a bad manager, they'd be unemployed every six to eight years, starting over at the bottom, always at the lower end of the pay scale, never accumulating more than the starting vacation benefits.

When that happens, and I don't deny that it does, the upper management needs to take action against those poor managers who, hopefully, arent protected by a union.

You talk about seniority. I can tell you that experience that comes with length of service has real value.

That is my point in a nutshell, and few companies take better care of their loyal senior employees than Wal-Mart. I know this for a fact. I am at the WM home office at least twice a week. I talk to all levels of the company.

I'm no fan of unions generally, but this thread is about why unions are created. Unions are created by bad management.

I can partially agree with that.

..... to continue shortly

[LuckyStrike]

Ok, but please be gentle.

[LANMaster]

Originally Posted by Lucky Strike

You talk of being an employer. Well Lan, I was a self employed business man for fourteen years before going to work for a corporation. I have been on both sides. Having a small business with with five employees does not give you a realistic perspective about a corporate work environment. The basic assumptions that are communicated by your attitude about hourly workers are way off base. You seem to have a basically negative view about workers.

That is not the case. We had great workers, and they were well compensated.
.... And I have worked on both sides of this fence, including being a grocery store employee in a union.

Well let me tell you Lan, as an employer/manager you run the company. You make the decisions. You decide who to hire or fire. You set the goals and objectives. You set the tone of the work environment. You make the rules. Your actions as manager determines whether or not there is an atmosphere of mutual respect, teamwork, and good morale. You are responsible for making sure that workers have the resources they need to do their jobs when they need them and where they need them.

No doubt. And if I fail to do all of those things, then perhaps my competitor will garner the better employees, eh?

If a workplace has jealosy, pettiness, bickering, low morale, and conflict, that is a reflection of the management.

Not always.

General Omar Bradley was one of the greatest leaders in history who was universally respected by both his subordinates and his superiors. He said that " any commander who is worth a warm bucket of spit knows that morale is, or can be, at least as important as any other single factor with respect to combat effectiveness" Well combat effectiveness is just one type of human performance of particular interest to a combat commander in war time, but I believe the statement applies equally to all forms of human performance.

Patton was an SOB, and his troops out-performed Bradleys on many levels.
100 miles in the snow to Bastogne in under 40 hours comes to mind.

To paraphrase: Any manager who is worth a warm bucket of spit knows that morale is, or can be, at least as important as any other single factor with respect to human performance.

Any owner knows that he/she can provide better for the employee outside of a union setting than can be accomplished within a union.

You make my point. The union builds a wall between the employee and employer. Placing them in adversary roles, and generally negatively effects the profitability of the company, making it more difficult to provide things that the employee can appreciate, such as bonuses, specific incentives, quarterly steak picnics (instead of the annual weenies & beans picnic) Service awards too.

But more importantly, the relationship between non union employees and management is that of getting the best out of your employee by providing incentive.
When I was union, my boss wasn't really the management as much as it was the union, which ended up costing me and my employer money that could have served us bother better in other ways.

Today's employer is realizing that to get the best possible people, they need to provide the best package.
An employer who doesn't realize that operates his/her business to their own peril.

Don't like the way an employer does bueiness? Seek employment elsewhere.

Unions had their place 50 years ago. There's absolutely NOTHING that today's union can provide that existing legislation won't take care of.

[LANMaster]

Originally Posted by LuckyStrike

Ok, but please be gentle.

I've known you here for a few years. I hold you in the highest regard.

[LuckyStrike]

Originally Posted by LANMaster

I've known you here for a few years. I hold you in the highest regard.

The feeling is mutual, and I know that my emotions sometimes invade my posts making them seem snotty. You, on the other hand are alway a gentleman. You would make a better manager than I would.

[SlackAli]

If LAN spent the amount of worktime on frivolous online pursuits in the UK as he does now, he'd need a union to represent him at the disciplinary hearing






Only joking Mike

[LANMaster]

Originally Posted by SlackAli

If LAN spent the amount of worktime on frivolous online pursuits in the UK as he does now, he'd need a union to represent him at the disciplinary hearing


Only joking Mike

For your information, my 1-hour lunchbreak just ended, so I will spare you the lengthy dissertation on why I am of value to my employer.
Suffice it to say, I regularly work overtime and on weekends. I put in an average of 50+ hours per week, and I do not get paid overtime.
But even more important than that, my output is always of the highest quality, creativity, and accuracy.
If this place were to turn union, I'd have to do some deep soul searching to determine if I wanted to stay. I would probably hand in my resignation.

[LANMaster]

Originally Posted by LuckyStrike

The feeling is mutual, and I know that my emotions sometimes invade my posts making them seem snotty. You, on the other hand are alway a gentleman. You would make a better manager than I would.

I think I was a pretty good manager, but I might be too lenient.
I make a better Indian than Chief.

[SlackAli]

Originally Posted by LANMaster

For your information, my 1-hour lunchbreak just ended, so I will spare you the lengthy dissertation on why I am of value to my employer.
Suffice it to say, I regularly work overtime and on weekends. I put in an average of 50+ hours per week, and I do not get paid overtime.
But even more important than that, my output is always of the highest quality, creativity, and accuracy.
If this place were to turn union, I'd have to do some deep soul searching to determine if I wanted to stay. I would probably hand in my resignation.

Lighten up, was a joke. No need to get defensive, you're amongst friends.

I realise you won't be able to reply now your lunchbreak's finished

[valis]

union, eh.......dunno.....don't know enough about them to comment on them, and don't really feel the urge to go research them,so I'm just going to turn the music up and go about my merry way.


la la la la la.....unions, eh?