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13-Mar-2012, 08:14 PM #211
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Originally Posted by helpful View Post

I don't personally care what faith a person is including faithlessness I am more concerned on policy since that is the job after all we are electing the person to do. Unless your telling me that you choose this person of 'x' faith because they will have this 'y' policy and in that case you have made my argument for me.
Agreed.......but I can guarantee you this; down here in this ol' Christian-based nation, you could have a reformed Nazi running on a Christian platform and they will be elected in a landslide over an atheist who favors anything whatsoever......
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13-Mar-2012, 08:59 PM #212
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riddle me this, if you will; the last election was ballyhooed as the 'vote for the lesser of two evils'. How the heck did we get to where we have to vote for ANY evil?

Problems inherent in a two-party system, I guess.
Many elections have been touted as "voting for the lesser of two evils" - I've never had that problem. I've always voted for the better candidate that supports most of my liberal tenets or will do the least damage to them. Circa 1997, that could have been either party - no more. In any case, extent of religiosity played no part - never has. At this point in time I would probably lean atheist if all other factors were on par, simply due to what I consider the damage religion has done to the world as a whole and the continuing silly arsed social issues that keep popping up that really have no meaning to anyone's quality of life.
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14-Mar-2012, 12:20 AM #213
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Agreed.......but I can guarantee you this; down here in this ol' Christian-based nation, you could have a reformed Nazi running on a Christian platform and they will be elected in a landslide over an atheist who favors anything whatsoever......
Sadly and pathetically true. But I don't let discrimination hold me back. If I have to choose between a Christian - real or feigned - and an Atheist I will choose the one with the platform that best serves my interest.
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14-Mar-2012, 12:27 AM #214
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Sadly and pathetically true. But I don't let discrimination hold me back. If I have to choose between a Christian - real or feigned - and an Atheist I will choose the one with the platform that best serves my interest.
Yes, but you're a rational human being, as am I. A rare breed, these days.
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14-Mar-2012, 01:06 AM #215
To add to that may I say that one of the biggest enemies of true democracy is partisan politics? "Vote for what is right, not for the ideology."
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14-Mar-2012, 07:08 AM #216
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To add to that may I say that one of the biggest enemies of true democracy is partisan politics? "Vote for what is right, not for the ideology."
Again, an ideal that is totally lost in a two-party system.
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14-Mar-2012, 08:32 AM #217
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Yes, but you're a rational human being, as am I. A rare breed, these days.
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To add to that may I say that one of the biggest enemies of true democracy is partisan politics? "Vote for what is right, not for the ideology."
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Originally Posted by Wino View Post
Many elections have been touted as "voting for the lesser of two evils" - I've never had that problem. I've always voted for the better candidate that supports most of my liberal tenets or will do the least damage to them. Circa 1997, that could have been either party - no more. In any case, extent of religiosity played no part - never has. At this point in time I would probably lean atheist if all other factors were on par, simply due to what I consider the damage religion has done to the world as a whole and the continuing silly arsed social issues that keep popping up that really have no meaning to anyone's quality of life.
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Again, an ideal that is totally lost in a two-party system.
Indeed. But is voting a key component of the Christian Nation? I believe Wendy already brought this up...would this label change if a non-Christian were elected? Were racist tendencies alleviated when Obama was elected?

No, of course not. In fact, I think it got worse but Obama really isn't the point of this thread, I use this example simply to explore the idea that electing a non-Christian may place more focus on the things that shouldn't be important to the job of the President. So, in essence, I'm saying that maintaining the status quo may not be such a bad idea here.

Unless a non-Christian with super power charisma were to come along.

Anyway, I don't think our elected leader, no matter who it is will change anything regarding the Christian Nation. It's part of the fabric. You can color the fabric, but it's still fabric. You can stretch or shrink it...but it's still fabric. If you tear the fabric, it doesn't function as well...and when you mend it back together: still fabric. To completely change the fabric you could burn it...but that's highly destructive and dangerous- burning the fabric doesn't get us what we want.

We need to weave new fabric, but we have to find the proper match.
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14-Mar-2012, 10:49 AM #218
Having been to the State Republican Convention, I can say with large certainty that such values are VERY relevant to a certain portion of the GOP. Others are more concerned with their alignment with the platform; and others strive for the most conservative individual they can get. A few don't care who it is; as long as they beat the "other side".

At least in primaries, I have observed a complex set of factors regarding choosing candidates, the least of which is religion.
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14-Mar-2012, 10:51 AM #219
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Having been to the State Republican Convention, I can say with large certainty that such values are VERY relevant to a certain portion of the GOP. Others are more concerned with their alignment with the platform; and others strive for the most conservative individual they can get. A few don't care who it is; as long as they beat the "other side".

At least in primaries, I have observed a complex set of factors regarding choosing candidates, the least of which is religion.
With all due respect, I call bull-honkey.

If a self-professed atheist were running for anything on a national scale (and mind you, they didn't rub your face in the fact that they were atheist, but definitely were proud and vocal about their beliefs) how far would they gate?

Maybe to the exit door. Maybe.....
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14-Mar-2012, 10:54 AM #220
Birds of a feather....
If I had two otherwise identical candidates and one had religious preferences closer to mine, done deal. But it never works out that way. There is a large set of selection criteria to choose from, and trade offs occur. I would take an atheist right now if they were a true conservative ( which of course I feel is important).

I'm not trying to bring politics in here. Just suggesting that religion does play a factor in elections.
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14-Mar-2012, 10:58 AM #221
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With all due respect, I call bull-honkey.

If a self-professed atheist were running for anything on a national scale (and mind you, they didn't rub your face in the fact that they were atheist, but definitely were proud and vocal about their beliefs) how far would they gate?

Maybe to the exit door. Maybe.....
Umm.. See if my post I was typing addresses this.

I know what you mean, Tim. But there are those who would pick anyone as long as they would beat the competition.

But I think your point has some validity, in that most all candidates will try to present themselves as a "family person; church going; civic leader... " blah blah.
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14-Mar-2012, 11:17 AM #222
I have seen enough of American politics to know that if an Atheist was to run for office in a high profile position the knives would come and (s)he would be subject to character assassination. Wasn't one of the Republican candidates subject to religious persceution because he is Mormon? I dare the American nation to separate religion from politics and have an election free from doctrine and based solely on policy.
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14-Mar-2012, 11:46 AM #223
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I know what you mean, Tim. But there are those who would pick anyone as long as they would beat the competition.
All I can say to that is that, down here in Texas, there were a TON of people voting for Hillary to win the primary just to keep Obama out......how screwed up is that?
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14-Mar-2012, 11:50 AM #224
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I dare the American nation to separate religion from politics and have an election free from doctrine and based solely on policy.
Impossible. You'd have a better chance getting elected officials to follow through on their campaign promises.
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14-Mar-2012, 02:07 PM #225
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Agreed. I never understand people who don't vote. It may be the choice between the lesser of two evils, but not choosing at all means you're just as comfortable with the greater of two evils. I like my evil in as small of a dose as I can get it.
I think people don't vote because they're afraid of being wrong or having to say, "oops, I voted for the wrong guy". They don't know enough about politics and just think they're taking the easy way out,.
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