[saikee]

I think you are going to be confused by many methods without knowing the principle behind.

First I don't use Acronis so I cannot commend on it. Presumably you let it back up your Vista image or it has a boot manager controlling Vista boot loader BCDedit as an additional layer of security management. If your Acronis secure zone controls the MBR then you have to beg for it having a function to dual boot other systems. If it doesn't control the MBR and Vista's own booting is managed by its own BCDedit then your system is just a standard PC, with which you can either select Grub or BCDedit to dual boot.

Using BCDedit involves twice more work than Grub to do any dual boot because it is every Linux installer's obligation to check every partition for a boot loader and include it for booting if one is found. Every MS system, from Dos to Vista, always has a boot loader inside it root partition so you don't have to lift a finger to achieve dual boot because everything is done automatically. What you have to give in is to let Grub taking over the MBR, which is restorable by any PC operating system.

If you install Ubuntu and "demand" its boot loader to be place inside its own residing partition then you will have no need to restore Vista's MBR but you still need to boot up a Linux Live CD to copy the first 512 bytes of Ubuntu's partition into the "c" drive of Vista for dual booting. Vista does not support non-MS systems so if you want its boot loader to boot a Linux you put the necessary information (first sector of the Linux partition) on a plate and deliver it to its front door ("c" drive) as the bugger won't come out to fetch it itself! Linux supports every other PC system so Grub will go out of Linux partition and into other partitions to get the necessary information to facilitate booting.

Only an operating system will need to access the MBR. Vista's MBR can be restored by any Vista installation disc in seconds. Vista can be booted without using its MBR so it is of no consequence if it is not there. However many people do not know how to cope without the MBR because they never tried a non-MS operating system.

[skiabox]

So what do you suggest me to do?
Have you seen this post(http://www.wilderssecurity.com/showp...14&postcount=6) ?
Is these instructions correct?
Should I keep grub and not restore vista mbr as the graphical guide I want to follow suggests?
Thanks again for your immediate response!

[saikee]

I was laughing when I read your link.

My assessment is this Acronis is no more sophisticated than the common MS MBR from Dos to XP. Only Vista changes it to its own but still on the same principle.

Basically the common MS MBR can be imagine as a blind person searching the 4 primary partitions (inside the MBR) and boots whichever one has the booting flag in the "on" position. This is one of the oldest technique people dualbooting the Dos systems.

The booting flag is just a byte inside the partition table. When one is set on the previous one would be off so that there can only be one "active" primary in any hard disk. Only MS systems, most of the BSD and Solaris use the booting flag. Linux never use the damn thing.

Thus your Acronis secure zone is another glorified boot loader. It boots Vista because its partition is active and is primary type. It can be used to boot a Linux if you arrange Linux installed in a primary partition and set it up as active. An active partition in Windows = bootable in Linux = booting flag set "on" position in the partition table.

The "sbin/grub-install /dev/boot_partition" or "sbin/lilo /dev/boot_partition" are just asking Linux to place the boot loader inside the boot_partition and not overwriting Acronis secure zone in the MBR. If you demand the Linux installer to place its boot loader inside the Linux partition then you don't have to go through the above step of using the "grub-install" command. If you need to use it chances are you have already permitted the installer to overwrite your MBR.

You can follow the Acronis steps but you will have one problem in booting back Vista because you need to switch on the booting flag from the Linux to the Vista partition. This is peanut for Grub. But your main problem is on exiting Vista its partition is active and so you will not be able to go back to Linux. Luckily this ground has been covered before. You will find this thread useful on how to switch the bootable partition back to Linux before exiting Vista.

Here is my own recommendation

(1) Install Linux in a primary partition (can only be sda3 or sda4 in your case) but make absolutely certain that the boot loader is installed inside the root partition and not the MBR. If you put Linux in one partition that will be its root partition. I think you have to click an "advance" box in Ubuntu installer to specify the location of the boot loader so watch it like a hawk.

(2) On completion of the Linux installation your Linux will not boot yet and that is what it should be. You can make it boot in Vista's disk management program by clicking the Linux partition "active".

(3) On a reboot Acronis will fire up Linux and not Vista.

(4) Post the Ubuntu's /boot/grub/menu.lst here if Grub doesn't dual boot Vista. Since your Vista is the 2nd primary it will fired up by Grub if these commands are available

title Vista in the second partition (hd0,1)
root (hd0,1)
makeactive
chainloader +1

[skiabox]

If I get it right I could follow this guide here
http://neosmart.net/wiki/display/EBCD/Ubuntu
and when I press advanced I must enter /dev/sda3 without parentheses?

[saikee]

That is it.

Prior to that you should have used the partition editor to delete sda3, recreate it in say 20 to 30Gb and the create a logical partition of say 1Gb as sda5 to be used as swap. This is because partitions created by a Linux partitioning program will be Type 83 suitable for any Linux installation. A swap has Type 82 ID. If a partition is created by Vista it will be type 7 suitable only for NTFS filing system. So using a Type 7 partition to install a Linux may cause you a future grief.

When you are given the choice to select which partition to install Ubuntu you highlight sda3, then click "edit", then click "format" to select Ext3 or Reiserfs (either one will do) and mount it as "/". This tells the installer that the partition sda3 must be formatted in the specified filing system and to be use for the root filing system of Ubuntu. Since no other partition is given sda3 is "/" or root of Ubuntu and /boot will be just a subdirectory to it. Every Linux boot loader would know how to boot it.

The swap partition need no more attention. Every Linux will use it whenever it is available as a scratch area so that there is no necessity to defrag the partition.

The installed image of Ubuntu only occupies about 3 to 4Gb so 20 to 30Gb is ample. By arranging the partitions the way I described above you will lose sda4 as the last primary and turn it into an extended partition. The 166Gb less 20 or 30 +1 Gb is still there available for future use with sda6, sda7, sda8 and so on ..... if you want.

[skiabox]

ok.
I installed ubuntu and put grub in ubuntu partition.
Now I still boot vista.
What should I do now?
You said before that 'You can make it boot in Vista's disk management program by clicking the Linux partition "active".'
Is this so simple?
Will I have a boot menu when I restart?
(I also deleted the acronis secure zone so that I can create unparitioned disk space.)

[skiabox]

ok!I am posting from ubuntu now!
I used the EasyBCD tool and I have two options now at boottime!

[saikee]

yeah, I missed the an important benefit of what BCDedit can dual boot in your case.

It will work out. Basically the Arconis can only fire up an active primary. This can be a Vista. When the Vista boot loader, which I call BCDedit as it got no name, fires up you can add Linux to the booting choices. Like I said Linux never has the need of being active or primary so it will boot regardless.

Hope this makes sense to you. It looks you have got it sorted.