[OldLadyWho]

Not sure if I've put this question in the right forum, or if it's even an appropriate question for TSG. But it's worth a try.

I'm one of 3 partners in a small publishing business. We hired someone to put up our website this week, and I had understood that we would have a secure area to take credit cards for sales.

I just found out today that they are only setting up a PayPal option. My heart sunk (sank?).

I've never used PayPal, but remember reading a few times that they have had serious security problems. I know a few people who say they won't use PayPal at all.

Found a few articles on the Internet, but it's all a little confusing and worrisome.

Does anyone here have experience using Paypal on their own websites? Have your customers had any problems or complaints? Are there things we should ask about before we set the account up?

Any thoughts or advice from those who have dealt with PayPal on a business basis would be very appreciated.

Thanks, OLW

[Trooper_fan]

Paypal wiped out my business account to the tune of almost £4,000 and wou;dn't pay it back. I know other people who have been scammed and had their accounts frozen so me personally I wouldn't touch them with a bargepole.

PayPal Sucks

[OldLadyWho]

Yikes...

Not good. Thanks for sharing that. How long ago did that happen?

My partners seem quite happy with the PayPal idea, and mine was the only dissenting voice. I hoped to ease my mind by finding out more, but it may just scare me more.

Anyone else have experiences as a web based business using PayPal? I've been Googling on my own too, if I'm going to present my partners with my fears & doubts, I figured I should have some information to back them up with.

To be honest, I was hoping NOT to come up with anything. I'd hoped that the problems were old news and that things have changed at PayPal.

Anyway, thanks for posting, it's very appreciated. OLW

[buddhafabio]

they are as secure as you are. i say that because, alot of people have lost money because scammers send fake emails to peoples addresses. saying to update account info. then they gladly punch it in and bingo the scammers have that account.

[SNBLAPER27]

My computor is 2 years old. Getting slower, and slower. How do I clean it up.
snblaper Thank you!

[OldLadyWho]

That's an excellent "heads up" observation. I am amazed at the amount of folks who still don't see the dangers out there.

I like to think I'm aware of security with my own little studio network, but my partners generally look at me with blank expressions if I mention things like that. They tend to leave the "boring" computer stuff to me (which is rather scary.)

Anyway. I can't say I'm very informed on how to make sure our business web site is secure. I don't know the web master well enough to know if she is good at security.

I'm not even sure of what questions to ask. In fact, when I've raised the issue before, everyone just smiles and says, "Yes, it's secure", without telling me why they think it is. I hate not even knowing what to look for.

Are there any specific things we need ask the company that's hosting our domain, to find out how they handle security?

I worry terribly about being such babes in the woods with this. If we get skunked ourselves it's one thing, we'll just learn a hard lesson...but I sure don't want to do anything to harm our customers...(I'm thinkin' it could be bad for business)

OLW

[Maggz]

I use paypal for many online transactions and im yet to lose anything. I use it on only sites I trust or have a good privacy policy. Since I dont have a credit card it comes in really really handy I also use it as my primary payment method at venkee.com (and only)

[OldLadyWho]

Thank you Maggz, I'm glad to hear your experience. I hadn't thought about it before, but you're right. We really do need to post our own privacy policy up front, & very prominantly, on our web site for our customers.

I think my concern was if PayPal was true to THEIR privacy policy, such as it is. I've spent the afternoon reading their contract. I've also read a lot of anti-PayPal information today. whew!

I'm thinking we can use them to get started, but should also keep our eyes out for alternative methods of conducting sales after we've grown a little. Hopefully we won't have to stay with PayPal for too long.

In the meantime we'll just pay very close attention to how they deal with things. I've heard their customer service leaves a lot to be desired. Even people who like them have commented on the mediocre support. Hopefully we'll have no problems while we're using them.

Thanks to all that have replied to this thread...It's been very helpful to hear personal experiences.

(I'm going to cruise on over to Venkee now, and see what it's all about.) Thanks Maggs!

OLW

[OldLadyWho]

Maggz, I just dropped by your Venkee website. Now I have questions.

How long have you been using Paypal? And, do you have any portfolios, or examples of your graphics work?

OLW

[Anne Troy]

I have been using paypal for about 3 years now. I have NEVER had any problems at all. The only people I know that did have problems were people whose morals I would question anyway; no offense to the person who posted above stating they had difficulty.

If things would ever get even remotely messy with a job I'm doing, I'd just move to paper check. I wouldn't use paypal for big money either tho...like more than $500 per transaction.

My husband and I also do web graphics/web development/Office development. Here's two works-in-progress: www.vbaexpress.com (mine, needs new menu buttons) and www.cdelly.com (client sample in the thick of development; still needs pictures; the property map will have programming that makes information about specific property lots--like square feet--come up when you hover over it--it's a very cool project that will probably take a month for completion)

[OldLadyWho]

Thanks for posting. I had hoped someone that had used PayPal for a year or more would see this and give some insight. After reading about all the pros and cons today (my brain is just about mush tonight from all the searching and reading), I've come to the conclusion that PayPal should work fine for us for now. We do have sales considerably over $500.00, but those are generally done through contact with our sales department. Much of what we do is customized. However, we felt we needed to accomodate smaller buyers too, so the web option and PayPal will cover that area.

I'm going to give my partners the link to here and let them read what others have written. I think your "$500.00 limit" advice is good. Thanks again. I'm such a worrier. I hate to go into something feeling so ignorant. My parners just never think about problems, so I'm the curmudgeon of the partnership and generally the one to look for problems before they happen...hopefully to avoid them.

I'm going to jog over and look at your web site now...
OLW

[faithchris]

Hi, I have used pay pal now for 3 years with some what of great sucess the only problems I have with them are if it is a major large purchase like 5000.00 they seem to hold on to that money a long time. I had to make quite a few calls to get it taken care of but in the end all way well. I use Pay pal on a regular basis so on a scale of 1 to 10 they have always come out a 10 for me. They do now at least have a number you can call for help with a problem and that number is 1-888-221-1161. I have had at least 500 transactions with them to date. Good Luck to you.

[Maggz]

Portfolio? Yes weve made many websites including www.dabu4u.com www.venkee.com/mmorpg and some others. We also do business apps and stuff.. I also hope to be able to use more than paypal in the future but right now its very convienent

[OldLadyWho]

Thank you, faithchris
(Hi Maggz!)

In the week that I've been asking questions about PayPal, I've gotten some interesting responses. I not only did some serious Googling, but also sent emails to the owners of a few websites that I visit regularly that I know have used PayPal for at least a year. Also sent e-mails out to friends and family to ask if anyone had used PayPal as an online buyer recently (rather than a business owner).

I actually got more complaints from those who have made purchases from websites using PayPal than I did from vendors. Seems that general customers are still a little leery of using them.

I've gotten 19 responses from vendors (representing a combination of long term users, new users, and past users of PayPal.)

Only 3 of all of them, including one in this thread of posts, didn't like PayPal at all. Everyone else pretty much felt that PayPal did a good job for them...but, almost all of them gave at least one or two things to be aware of and watch out for.

So, just in case others might find what I learned useful, here's my own conclusions about PayPal:

-It's an excellent & economical tool to help new online businesses get started selling.

-Access to customer service is easier, and friendliness has improved somewhat in recent months.

-Accounts shouldn't be used regularly for large sales (Most suggested limiting to $500.00, or less)

-Accounts should not be allowed to accumulate money. (suggestions were to transfer any accumulated amount over $500.00 into a regular bank account ASAP) Apparently PayPal does have a reputation for freezing assets without notice, and taking their time sorting things out, before unfreezing things again or giving reasons for the freeze...so, it's not good to have very much sitting in the account.

One question that I am still a little confused about is how liable PayPal is for money in their care. (I'm not sure I'm asking the question very clearly)

For instance. If PayPal suddenly went out of business and closed up shop...are they insured? Reading their legal policy was hard to do. Some of it was confusing. I came away with the impression that they pretty much have the power to do as they please, if they please, and can change their minds whenever they please.

Some folks have pointed out that PayPal is not a bank, and isn't required to carry the same type of insurance banks have to carry. I've also read that they aren't under the same rules as "real" financial institutions...so, even though they try to walk like a bank, and talk like a bank...they really aren't, and those who use them should keep those things in mind and not allow too much of their business money to reside in PayPal's accounts.

And, with all that said (and being forewarned and prepared for possible PayPal pitfalls), my partners and I have decided to go with PayPal for now.

(I'll post the link to our new site when it's up and running.

Thanks again to everyone that posted and shared their experiences. I learned a lot, and appreciated your help tremendously.

The TSG forum is worth its weight in gold...(hmmm...how much does a forum weigh, I wonder? lol!)
Maybe a better way to say it is: This forum is priceless.
OLW

[RandyG]

It's an important distinction, that between what Vendors say and what your buyers prefer.

If you need to get setup quickly, then use PayPal, but I would recommend looking into services that are trusted by the buyer. I use WorldPay for my site, and it is part of The Royal Bank of Scotland Group.

I would have gone with Verisign's payment portal services, but they don't handle international companies, only those in the States.

Having the buyers confidence is paramount!

I have been working in eCommerce for the last 4 1/2 years, researching and building our site. I use PayPal for donating to TSG, and a $4 monthly subscription service. I wouldn't trust it with several thousand dollars /month business, but that is only an opinion, and not based in using it.

Just some humble opinions, both as an online shopper and eCommerce website owner