[JohnWill]

http://www.redmondpie.com/jailbreak-...ckra1n-zni327/

That didn't take long, so much for the "impossible to jailbreak" firmware.

[burntreality]

Yeah but it looks like Apple is still at it trying to prevent newer models :

http://www.iphonehacks.com/2009/10/a...lbreaking.html

[Soundy]

Sad but true, no matter how hard you try to make something hack-proof, someone else WILL find a way to hack it... and the only losers are your everyday Average Joe users. Like, seriously... why do I (speaking as 99.9% of users out there) need to plug in a 25-character alphanumeric serial number anytime I reinstall WinXP or Office? Does it really make it that much harder to pirate? No... just makes it more of a pain in the arse. (Speaking as a self-proclaimed geek, of course, I just slipstream the key into the installation, but that's another story...)

The real question is whether the sad part is that people will just hack things anyway... or that companies actually think they can outwit the hackers. One wonders how much development money is wasted on this futility?

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by Soundy

The real question is whether the sad part is that people will just hack things anyway... or that companies actually think they can outwit the hackers. One wonders how much development money is wasted on this futility?

In the grand scheme of things, I doubt significant development money is spent on thwarting hacking success. As iPhone developers are working on firmware updates to fix bugs, they could easily make other changes to effectively "harden" the software while the "patient is open", so to speak.

What I wonder is do those who choose to "jailbreak" their iPhone send Apple feedback as to the features and functions they want in their iPhone or do they just use whatever info has been disseminated and think they are part of the "cool" crowd?

There are some aspects of doing this that I completely understand. Things like wanting to use the iPhone with a carrier other than AT&T seems somewhat reasonable. Now that I think about it, that seems like the only real reason to muck with the firmware of the iPhone at all. LOL

Your point about the "average joe" ultimately paying the price is right on the money. It is unfortunate that the "average joe" ends up having to go through unnecessary effort to use products without any shenanigans but I also understand the product vendor taking measures to minimize the success rate of those trying or wanting to "crack the system".

Peace...

[burntreality]

There are many reasons to jailbreak your phone. The ability to multi-task is only available to those users with a jailbroken device. I don't think I could live without a program to quick reply to SMS. Without a jailbroken device I would have to quit whatever program I was in, reply to that person, and then relaunch the program. Even something as simple as customizing your wallpaper cannot be done without a jailbroken device.

There will always be the bad seeds out there that do use a hacked device for illegal purposes, but for people like me jailbreaking a device just enables full customization of the phone.

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by burntreality

There are many reasons to jailbreak your phone. The ability to multi-task is only available to those users with a jailbroken device. I don't think I could live without a program to quick reply to SMS. Without a jailbroken device I would have to quit whatever program I was in, reply to that person, and then relaunch the program. Even something as simple as customizing your wallpaper cannot be done without a jailbroken device.

So, my question to you would be: if you knew the iPhone didn't do multi-tasking at the time you bought it, why would you buy it? I believe the Palm-Pre does multi-tasking and I don't know about the BlackBerry. In fact, a friend of mine told me he got a Palm-Pre instead of an iPhone because the iPhone didn't do multi-tasking.

If the iPhone doesn't do what you want or need, why buy it at all?

There will always be the bad seeds out there that do use a hacked device for illegal purposes, but for people like me jailbreaking a device just enables full customization of the phone.

For the record, I'm not talking about hacking the device to use it for illegal activity. I fully understand wanting to have more "control" over the device and what you can do with it but shouldn't that factor in when you make the purchase decision?

Another way to ask the question is: why did you go ahead and buy an iPhone if multi-tasking is a requirement of yours and the iPhone doesn't officially support that functionality?

Peace...

[Fanis]

Wow! Obviously, I am still way behind the curve in this technological age. I've barely been keeping my head above water repairing PCs, setting up home/small business networks and small-time web designs. Problems with SPAM email is enough to make me crazy.

Now, the great guru JohnWill has introduced me to jailbreaking an iPhone!!!!!!!!!!! I volunteer for a local outreach ministry, which gave me a first generation iPhone as an appreciation gift shortly around the time they first came out. I was very appreciative! Still, once I began using the iPhone, I was disappointed in 3 major areas - inability to cut/paste/copy, inability to download customized ringtones and inability to view multimedia messages. (When someone sends a photo via text message, I am forced to go to an AT&T website within 7 days to view it and I cannot save the image from their screen. So, I zoom in, PrintScreen and paste into Photoshop.)

Am I understanding that this jailbreak software will fix these issues?

[burntreality]

I do believe that the Cut/Copy/and Paste can be done on your original Iphone, all you have do it is upgrade to 3.0 or greater.
Custom ringtones can be made easily either through Itunes or 3rd party software, the program I use is called IRinger.
MultiMedia messaging is available on the Iphone 3Gs and Iphone 3G, I do not know if it was released on the original Iphone though. I know on jailbroken devices there is an option to enable MMS on the original Iphone.
There are alot of downsides to jailbreaking your phone though, I can honestly say it is not for everyone. You "void your warranty" by doing so (which can easily be put back to normal with a simple restore). Also you cannot update the Iphone OS, until a jailbreak gets released.


Also to answer your questions tomdkat, I agree there are alot of other phones out there that might be better suited. When I originally made my phone choice the Iphone(aside from the multitasking aspect) met all my other criteria. In the area I live in At&T has the best coverage, so the Palm Pre and alot of other phones were not really a choice for me. The drawbacks of the Iphone were very minor and the good very much so out weighed the bad.
Since Jailbreaking my phone has enabled the phone do anything I want and need, it is the perfect phone for me

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by burntreality

I do believe that the Cut/Copy/and Paste can be done on your original Iphone, all you have do it is upgrade to 3.0 or greater.

This also raises another point. Some functions enabled through "jailbreaking" will only be available by "jailbreaking". Other functions, though, might be in development or available in subsequent releases of the firmware. Is it unreasonable to ask the "early adopters" (who those who bought the first gen iPhones are) to give the device a chance to mature a bit and see what other features/functions will become available as updates are developed and distributed?

Also to answer your questions tomdkat, I agree there are alot of other phones out there that might be better suited. When I originally made my phone choice the Iphone(aside from the multitasking aspect) met all my other criteria. In the area I live in At&T has the best coverage, so the Palm Pre and alot of other phones were not really a choice for me. The drawbacks of the Iphone were very minor and the good very much so out weighed the bad.
Since Jailbreaking my phone has enabled the phone do anything I want and need, it is the perfect phone for me

Fair enough. I didn't mean to single you out but you were "convenient". My questions were more of a general nature than asking you, specifically, but I do appreciate your answer and thank you.

Peace...

[burntreality]

Originally Posted by tomdkat

Is it unreasonable to ask the "early adopters" (who those who bought the first gen iPhones are) to give the device a chance to mature a bit and see what other features/functions will become available as updates are developed and distributed?

I 100% agree with you. I am just one of those people who want my phone to do everything it is capable of. I am sure over time Apple will release what the majority wants. *cough* Even though it did take them 2 years to finally give us MMS *cough*

Originally Posted by tomdkat

Fair enough. I didn't mean to single you out but you were "convenient". My questions were more of a general nature than asking you, specifically, but I do appreciate your answer and thank you.

Peace...

Not a problem

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by tomdkat

Another way to ask the question is: why did you go ahead and buy an iPhone if multi-tasking is a requirement of yours and the iPhone doesn't officially support that functionality?

Sometimes... because you know it WILL support it, with a little extra work. And sometimes because there are other attractive, unique features that are greater priorities.

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by Soundy

Sometimes... because you know it WILL support it, with a little extra work. And sometimes because there are other attractive, unique features that are greater priorities.

I guess. However, this sounds more like an interest in the 'novelty' of owning an iPhone than anything else.

Do others with Blackberry devices, Google Android devices, or Palm Pre devices do these same kinds of things (e.g. effectively cracking their devices to get additional functionality)?

Peace...

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by tomdkat

I guess. However, this sounds more like an interest in the 'novelty' of owning an iPhone than anything else.

Do others with Blackberry devices, Google Android devices, or Palm Pre devices do these same kinds of things (e.g. effectively cracking their devices to get additional functionality)?

Peace...

Sure. My first Windows Mobile phone was an HTC Titan - I knew it had built-in GPS capability that wasn't enabled with the stock ROMs. It wasn't a feature that I bought it for specifically, but I did choose it over other phones because I knew the capability was there, and soon found the info I needed to download a new loader, radio, and system ROM to enable the functionality that was inherent in the hardware.

I have a Samsung Omnia now (also WinMo)... it's nice, but I'd prefer an iPhone, I think. Several friends have them, and the one thing I've noticed is how smooth they operate. I get a lot of pauses and delays and hesitation, even with the more advanced Omnia... meanwhile the iPhone's operation is smooth as glass.

One thing to Apple's credit, they put a lot of time, thought and effort into their user interface, and it shows. The iPhone's "gestures" navigation is something that a lot of other phones try to copy... why? Because it's friendly and it works well. I've tried numerous different shells and interfaces on my WinMo phones, and for me at least, the ones that mimic the iPhone's are the most effective *overall*. Their accelerometer operation (the thing that turns the display when you turn the phone on its side) is FAR faster, smoother, and more usable than my Omnia's for example.

There are some benefits to other methods - having the Windows-like "Start Menu" has some advantages - but if I rated everything about both platforms on a scale of 1-5, the iPhone would probably come up with the highest average by a large margin.

Only problem... my carrier doesn't have the iPhone (yet - supposed to be within a month!), and since I've had the same carrier and phone number for 15+ years (and been reasonably happy with them), I'm not in a rush to change it.

The whole point of having downloadable "apps" for a phone, OR a computer, for that matter, is to make it do other things that it can't do "out of the box". Hacking a phone for more functionality is not far removed from overclockers trying to squeeze more performance from their PCs, or guys flashing their routers with DD-WRT to give them new features that the hardware is capable of but the manufacturer has chosen not to implement.

It's no different than the desire to "soup up" ones car, for that matter - beefing up the engine for more power, the brakes for better stopping, the tires and suspension for better handling... old Datsuns were popular for the longest time because they were cheap to buy and could be easily modded for a LOT more power. Cars with Chevy 350 engines have been popular with project builders for decades, because they're easy to work on and there are TONS of aftermarket parts to give them power they're not originally built with. Hondas are especially popular with the "ricers" today for the same reason.

Sure you could go out and just drop more money on a more powerful car, but for some people, part of the excitement, the love of the car, the bragging rights... is doing it yourself... maybe doing it a little different than everyone else... maybe just teaching yourself how it all works.

[tomdkat]

Originally Posted by Soundy

Sure. My first Windows Mobile phone was an HTC Titan - I knew it had built-in GPS capability that wasn't enabled with the stock ROMs. It wasn't a feature that I bought it for specifically, but I did choose it over other phones because I knew the capability was there, and soon found the info I needed to download a new loader, radio, and system ROM to enable the functionality that was inherent in the hardware.

I have a Samsung Omnia now (also WinMo)... it's nice, but I'd prefer an iPhone, I think. Several friends have them, and the one thing I've noticed is how smooth they operate. I get a lot of pauses and delays and hesitation, even with the more advanced Omnia... meanwhile the iPhone's operation is smooth as glass.

Ok, fair enough.

One thing to Apple's credit, they put a lot of time, thought and effort into their user interface, and it shows. The iPhone's "gestures" navigation is something that a lot of other phones try to copy... why? Because it's friendly and it works well.

Yep, this is definitely something Apple brings to the table. I'm not speaking about the iPhone specifically, but about Apple products in general. I really dig the OS X interface, for example.

The whole point of having downloadable "apps" for a phone, OR a computer, for that matter, is to make it do other things that it can't do "out of the box". Hacking a phone for more functionality is not far removed from overclockers trying to squeeze more performance from their PCs, or guys flashing their routers with DD-WRT to give them new features that the hardware is capable of but the manufacturer has chosen not to implement.

I don't liken downloadable apps for a computing device to "hacking" a computing device but I agree with your analogy with overclocking CPUs. Those who overclock their CPUs don't seek help or support from the vendor. If they have success, they can reap the benefit. If they don't, that's their own problem. Good analogy.

Sure you could go out and just drop more money on a more powerful car, but for some people, part of the excitement, the love of the car, the bragging rights... is doing it yourself... maybe doing it a little different than everyone else...

The thing is, I don't think the iPhone is (or was) the least expensive device out there. It might be the coolest but certainly not the least expensive. I also don't know how the price of the iPhone compares to competitors. Is the Palm Pre more expensive than the iPhone?

maybe just teaching yourself how it all works.

I highly doubt this is the case for most doing it but there most certainly is a lot of interest in doing it.

With the above being stated, how much of the functionality that have wrung out of your iPhone (or other mobile devices) did you request from the manufacturer of said device? If you modified your iPhone to do back flips, have you asked Apple to add "back flip" functionality to the iPhone (as an example)?

Peace...

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by tomdkat

Yep, this is definitely something Apple brings to the table. I'm not speaking about the iPhone specifically, but about Apple products in general. I really dig the OS X interface, for example.

Look at the iPod, for that matter... a LOT of other players copy the look and layout of the "click wheel", but not its functionality. I know some people don't like it... I, personally, find it very smooth and very intuitive (something Apple seems to be big on all around), although I will admit it's a little too touchy at times on my 3rd-gen Nano (could have something to do with my fat thumbs, too). They keep the display clean and simple, but informative. Sure it costs more than a lot of others... but most of the cheap knockoffs I've seen, while looking good in their packaging, FEEL really cheap once you get them out and start using them.