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Copying an "Unlawful to Duplicate" Key

Discussion in 'Do It Yourself (Not Computer-Related)' started by jp1203, May 3, 2009.

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  1. jp1203

    jp1203 Thread Starter

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    Hey All-

    I was just given two BEST padlocks, very heavy duty locks with 7 pin removable cores.

    The issue is, I only have one set of keys, a single master and a single control (for removing the core). I hate having just one key to something because if I ever lose the key, there's no realistic way to get another.

    For most locks, the solution would be to copy the key. Well, there are two problems with that for this lock:
    1. They are Best keys, which, if I am not mistaken, are very difficult to get blanks for. While anyone would have a Schlage or Kwikset blank in stock, from what I can tell Bests can only be obtained from the manufacturer.
    2. They are stamped prominently "IT IS UNLAWFUL TO DUPLICATE THIS KEY."

    Because it's my key and lock, I'm not breaking any rules that I know of by trying to get a copy, but how would I be able to do this at all. FWIW, I scanned the top of the key to show the "Unlawful to duplicate" stamp.

    Thanks,

    Joe
     

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  2. Byteman

    Byteman Moderator Malware Specialist

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    Have a look, scroll down to the Do Not Duplicate area.....

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Key_(lock)#Do_Not_Duplicate_key

    I would take the two locks with me to a shop, that should be all you need to do to verify that you own just the locks, and are not duplicating a security area key....

    http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=447403

    Here's a shop that sells key blanks with the "Do not duplicate" already stamped on them> http://www.clksupplies.com/shop/index.php?cPath=24_58&osCsid=a871f6e8bbf90596661569b5fed344ce

    So, it is entirely possible that you will find a shop to make a copy for you. The stamp is just a choice the owner can have to help prevent someone making a copy.
     
  3. hewee

    hewee

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    I have had copy of keys made more then once with "Do not duplicate" on them. But they were cheaper Schlage or Kwikset or Westlock house keys. Well they were what are call job or master keys to housing tracks.
    Job keys work till part is remover from lock or once the key to that lock is used that disables the job key. A master key will always work but those only a couple have because they will let you in any house.

    But the thing is you can get the keys made any place and many places they are kids because a hardware store or Kmart, Walmart and places like that most will not look. Also other knew what I did for work so knew you had to have keys like I did. Then still some places should not have made copies of the keys just because it says..."Do not duplicate".
     
  4. Drabdr

    Drabdr Moderator

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    Byteman and Hewee pretty much covered it. But I would call some locksmiths and first see if they think they can tackle the task (I might not mention the do not duplicate thing on the phone).

    Sometimes when a locksmith is going work for one organization, the organization may ask them to put that on their keys. So if you have the locks, I don't think there should be an issue. Maybe if you know where the locks came from, you can find out what locksmith they were using.

    Carry the lock and the key to a locksmith, and they should be able to figure something out on it.

    Have you contacted the mfg. of the lock? Is there a number on the key or lock, where you might can get an extra key?
     
  5. thefonz

    thefonz

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    Some info correct, some not." Do not duplicate", really is worthless and nothing more than a 'request' but not enforcible by any means. It's often used for hopeful key control, but not effective. The 'unlawful to duplicate' on the best keys also no longer holds any merit since their patent ran out a while back. Any decent locksmith will have the best keys and would be able to make copies. Some honor the do not duplicate, others don't, and on very common keyways such as Schlage or kwikset, there would be no reason to look at the key to see if it is there.
    Restricted keys are another matter and the end user has paid for the right to not have the keys duplicated by anyone except those on their "authorized" list. Basically, if someone wants key control, they need to pay for a restricted keyway.
     
  6. kjbenner

    kjbenner

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    If getting the blank is the issue, McMaster-Carr carries Best blanks. You can find your part number here: http://www.mcmaster.com/#10655aac/=1twxff . Unfortunately, it looks like they might only come in packs of ten.

    If you can't find anybody that will duplicate your key because of the DND stamp, you can always photocopy your key, glue/tape it to the blank, and shape it by hand with a triangular file.
     
  7. thefonz

    thefonz

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    One won't have much luck with that on the best locks. The tolerances are much tighter than locks such as kwikset or schlage.
     
  8. hewee

    hewee

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    Wrap some tape around the key and mark it to say Lock 1 or what ever and Lock 2 for the other key and then no one will see the stamp on the key.
     
  9. guy2

    guy2

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    you can hammer out the print pretty easy because key's are made from very malleable metal Brass/copper.

    almost like hammering the face of a penny
     
  10. StumpedTechy

    StumpedTechy

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  11. thewonder

    thewonder

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    I am a locksmith and manage the store and shop for WARMAN SECURITY here in SF. You should have no problem getting a Best key copied if it is on an A, B, C, D, E, .... blank. The only time you may have trouble is when the key is on a CURRENT restricted key blank. As was stated earlier there are hundreds of key blanks that say DO NOT DUPLICATE. Very Few are actually current restricted keyways. Most companies still in operation today have some form of factory restricted key program, like Schlage Primus or Everest and some specialize in restricted keys like MEDECO HIGH SECURITY.

    The trick is always use an actual LOCKSMITH, with an actual storefront, to get keys copied because:

    1. A locksmith will have a much wider range of keyblanks and other security items.
    2. The key cutting machines will actually be gagged in. We will regularly check for instance if our key machines are working properly by taking new factory keys and making copy after copy to get as many working generations as we can.
    3. The locksmith will be able to give you correct information and at a much deeper level that some one at a hardware store.
    4. The locksmith will have the suppliers need to get you the correct keys, locks, safes...
    for your needs faster than a hardware store.

    * MAKE SURE THE LOCKSMITH YOU CHOOSE HAS A REAL STOREFRONT AND HAS BEEN AROUND A WHILE, TRY LOOKING FOR REVIEWS LIKE YOU WOULD ANYTHING ELSE.

    ** NEVER ASSUME THAT BECAUSE SOMEONE HAS AN ADD IN THE PHONE BOOK THEY ARE LEGIT!!! IN MOST AREAS 50% OR MORE OF THE ADDS IN THE PHONE BOOK ARE FLY BY NIGHT CROOKS, SOMETIMES LISTING REAL LOCKSMITHS ADDRESS'S AS THEIR OWN.

    With a little common sense and stop by your local Locksmith you should be able to obtain keys, locks, safes, mailbox's, entry systems and consultations on putting together security CCTV systems with as little fuss as possible. Don"t be afraid, your local Locksmith is open to serve YOU!
     
  12. jp1203

    jp1203 Thread Starter

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    Thanks for the info, everyone.

    I'm guessing that the little "D" on the key means it's a D keyway? By what you say, it sounds as though it's not too difficult to get a copy. For instance, my library keys say "Do Not Duplicate" on them as well, but I know they're just Schlage SC1 keys, so there's no power behind it, as I seem to understand.

    However, the store has Best locks on absolutely everything, and on the cores they read Best S507 2. The keys are similar to my padlock keys (which don't even fit into the locks), they are blank on one side, and on the other have the same star pattern, same message, but a newer "3EST" logo instead, and no little letter. I'm betting this is still a restricted keyway and would therefore be very difficult to copy.

    Next time I'm in the area, I'll stop by J&J Lock. I know they used to do all of the hospital's locksmith work and have been around for a very long time.

    Thanks for all the information!
     
  13. jp1203

    jp1203 Thread Starter

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    For what it's worth, I might as well ask you this question:

    This key fits my front door deadbolt, which I rarely use. It's the only key I or anyone else has to it. A year or two ago, I tried to get copies made and found it surprisingly difficult. The top looks just like the school keys, which are SK1/CO62 Corbin locks. The rest, however is completely different. One locksmith looked right at it, looked very surprised and said "Taiwan Import Key" then "What is this to?" in an "I suspect you're up to no good" tone. He tried copying it onto some key that has an obnoxiously big top and says "US Lock" on it, and didn't charge for it saying he doubted it would work, but it was the closest thing he had. It fits the lock but doesn't turn. Any kwikset key fits and doesn't turn, though, so it wasn't much of an accomplishment. I haven't tried copying it since then because it's not really an urgent need.

    Any ideas?
     

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  14. JohnWill

    JohnWill Retired Moderator

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    That looks just like my Kwikset keys, and I'm pretty surprised that if the fit into the lock properly, you can't make a key that works. I have a real problem with the fact they can't make a key to fit, the only thing that comes to mind is the length of the key from the shoulder. I'll bet I could have a key that fit that lock in 10 minutes. :)
     
  15. jp1203

    jp1203 Thread Starter

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    I can get any kwikset key to fit the lock, but they don't go very smoothly for some reason, it's almost like I have to push too hard to get the key in. That key fits kwikset locks, but same thing is the case--it's a little bit of a push to get it in.

    Granted, I only have two kwikset keys and locks to try them on. Everyplace else I have keys to is Schlage, Arrow, Best, Corbin-Russwin, or Sargent, because other than the house keys, every other building I have keys to is not residential and gets considerably higher use than a house lock, so they obviously are going to use something commercial-grade.
     
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