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Hard drive failure or?

2K views 32 replies 6 participants last post by  Macboatmaster 
#1 ·
A friend brought me her laptop to try to figure out why it suddenly refuses to boot. On initial power-up I get the Toshiba splash screen which looks normal, but then the machine goes to a black screen and from that point is unresponsive.

My first thought was to determine whether the machine would boot from a Linux USB stick, or from a Linux live CD. I attempted both options from the F12 boot options menu, and the machine would not boot from either choice.

I then removed the hard disk from the laptop and installed it in a USB disk drive enclosure. If I plug the drive into my own desktop machine running Windows, I can read the files on the drive from the laptop without any difficulty. So the drive seems to be working fine.

Next, I checked to see if I could boot from the Linux USB stick with the hard drive still removed from the Laptop. Turns out that I can, and Linux runs just fine.

Finally, I plugged the hard drive, still in the USB drive caddy, into the laptop wile it was still running Linux. I would have expected that Linux would be able to mount the disc and view the Windows files. Linux shows the presence of the disk, but will not mount it.

My working theory is that the drive is basically ok, but the boot record may have been damaged somehow. But I don't have an obvious way to prove it, or to fix the problem if that's what is wrong. The laptop was running Windows 10, and I don't have another Windows 10 machine to fix it from.

So, where do I go from here?
 
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#28 ·
First, I must apologize for my unwarranted curt reply to your previous suggestions. I have followed this forum for long enough to recognize you as one of the contributors that has spent an enormous amount of time trying to help people resolve their computing problems. You are one of a handful who make this forum the valuable resource that it is.

All of the following experiments were done with the HDD reinstalled in the laptop:

I did try again to force the display of the Windows recovery screen, to no avail. I don't believe that Windows is even getting loaded. I didn't mention it before, but following the display of the Toshiba splash screen, the transition to the blank screen is immediate. I see the blank screen with only the cursor character displayed with no perceptible delay when the splash screen times out. Way faster than I would expect Windows to get loaded and running.

I tried an external monitor. The all of the symptoms previously described are presented on the external monitor. Interestingly, when I powered up the machine with the external monitor connected, the video was directed to the external monitor only. I checked the BIOS settings and found an option for Power On Display, which is set to Auto Select. The other option is System LCD, which apparently forces the video to the LCD regardless of whether there is an external monitor connected.

Regarding input from the keyboard. I've discovered that the symptoms aren't consistently reproducible from one power-up to the next. The machine generally comes up with the Num Lock light on and the Caps Lock off. Sometimes you can toggle them, sometimes they don't respond. Most of the time, <ctl> <alt> produces no response, but occasionally (following a subseqent power -up) it will initiate a return to the Toshiba splash screen which recycles back to the blank screen. Other keyboard input produces no response at all. I see no evidence of keyboard problems when I'm working from the BIOS settings screen, or when I am running from.

So, more to think about.
 
#29 · (Edited)
Cheers
Thanks for your kind remarks

There is such a miscellany of errors with for instance the laptop battery, the cmos battery, the possible drive error and the seemingly transient keyboard error, that it is really difficult to know where to start.

The Windows 10 that was on that hard drive should have been a digitally activated windows 10, registered against the hardware hash of the computer - the Toshiba laptop.
That being the case 10 installed on another drive will activate automatically when connected to the internet.

I presume at this time you do not want to have the customer incur the expense of a new drive - if we presume - that it may NOT be the drive but other hardware in the laptop, as evidenced possibly by the apparent range of errors.

IF THE SPARE drive you have is sufficient to install 10, and bearing in mind that you say, with that drive you can boot usb without a problem, then I think the way forward is to insert that drive in the laptop.

Download on another computer the Windows 10 installation media from this link
Download Windows 10 (microsoft.com)

go to download tool now and follow - procedure for create installation media
Follow these steps to create installation media (USB flash drive or DVD) you can use to install a new copy of Windows 10, perform a clean installation, or reinstall Windows 10.

If the computer on which you are doing this has windows 8 or 10 it will then create the usb flash pen for you.
NO third party tool is required.

You then boot the Toshiba from the usb pen, with the spare drive you have installed.
YOU THEN follow this procedure
CLEAN install of 10 on MBR
PLEASE READ IT CAREFULLY
You follow section 14
HOWEVER you need to read it first up to there and when you get to that stage you need to delete all partitions on the drive as explained in that section 14.
(1) Clean Install Windows 10 | Tutorials (tenforums.com)

You will see at stage 10 where you select the edition and then at stage 14 you should see your drive (your spare drive)

NOTE VITAL
You must select the correct edition of 10 that was on the laptop - eg Professional, Home and the same bit version - it would be 64bit I am sure.
(You should be able to check that on the non booting original drive - connected to your computer by usb - making sure of course this time it does not boot from it)

====================================

If it installs and runs OK - even if it is not activated then you will know that all is apparently good with the laptop. (It should activate but ONLY if you have the correct version eg HOME - Professional etc and the correct bit version and language.
You may then decide on the way forward.
IF YOU DECIDE to pursue this route then if you ned help please ask.
=========================================================================================

On a different issue the BIOS can be updated outside of windows as here
Support Home (dynabook.com)
WinRAR self-extracting ZIP file includes both Windows-based and diskette based BIOS update installation options. See the included documentation for details.
See attached BIOS flash text

Also please see my screenshot showing the files when you download the BIOS flash and unzip it.

IF you have the writeable CD that may be the easier way.
However I believe that you can achieve the same by making the ISO that would go on the CD - onto a bootable USB using RUFUS
I have NOT of course tried that but in theory it should work.

I would recommend to you that you try the install of 1o on your spare drive BEFORE you consider the BIOS flash

=======================================================================================
For the install of 10 this will help
The laptop came with
Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium 64-bit
so it is a fair bet that the windows 10 will be Home - 64 bit
Windows 7 Home Premium will be upgraded to Windows 10 Home.
see attachment for your laptop spec
 

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#30 ·
Well, the ground has shifted under this problem. The owner informed me yesterday that they went out and bought a brand new laptop. Probably the best path forward rather than trying to keep an antique going.

In the light of that, I'm going to table this science project for a bit until I'm sure that they have all the data I recovered off the old drive safely transferred to the new machine. They had one video file that was too large to copy on to the USB stick, so I'll probably put the old HDD into the USB enclosure again so they can copy that file to the old machine.

I'd still like to get the old machine working again, and the information you provided in your last post gives me hope that it may be possible. Will have to spend some time digesting the info you provided.

I really appreciate the effort you have spent trying to help me make sense of all this. If I manage to get the beast running again, I'll let you know.
 
#31 ·
I really appreciate the effort you have spent trying to help me make sense of all this. If I manage to get the beast running again, I'll let you know.
Cheers
It will be an interesting exercise.

I do not know if you have a great knowledge of 10, but you may wish to advise the owner of the new laptop, that many of the problems on 10 appear to be caused by the use of third party apps that relate in any manner to system maintenance. Defraggers especially do not work well on 10, which has its own drive maintenance/defrag/trim app

This often encountered unsuitability of 10 to many third party apps is also true of many Anti Virus programs. Evidence tends to suggest that the FREE included Windows Security app which includes Windows Defender (Microsoft Defender and many other security measures) albeit it is no longer called such in the newer versions of 10 is the most suitable.

Many third party AV programs APPEAR to produce problems especially after version updates for 10 which are now very much on a regular rolling cycle
 
#32 ·
You're very right that I don't have much experience with Windows 10. Microsoft lost me when they came out with their "It's FREE and we're going to force it down your throat" policy.

I am aware that Win-10 handles most system maintenance and anti-virus tasks as well as or better than most third party tools. That said, I'd be astonished if this new machine didn't come with a trial version of McAfee preinstalled. That was the case for another newly purchased machine by a relative recently. I knew enough to advise her to uninstall McAfee and turn on Defender, and to my knowledge she has had no problems.
 
#33 ·
Indeed
It will as you say more than likely come with a free trial of whatever AV that make usually offers
Good to have worked with you again
Take care
 
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