Peace at any cost

Dark Star

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Joined
Jun 8, 2001
Messages
3,054
I received this from a friend in Canada this AM, I was going to post it then I thought nah...................

Then I thought twice of it and said, just post it okay fine.

I haven't a clue as to the original source of it, so perhaps some have seen this before.

Peace At Any Cost.

With the start of the United States War on Terrorism, many of us have witnessed, and many more of us will encounter "Peace Activists" who will try to convince us that we must refrain from retaliating against the ones who terrorized us all on September 11, 2001.

These activists may be alone or in a gathering. Most of us do not know how to react to them. When you come upon one of these people, or one of their rallies, here are the proper rules of etiquette:

Listen politely while this person explains their views. Strike up a conversation if necessary and look very interested in their ideas. They will tell you how revenge is immoral, and that by attacking the people who did this to us; we will only bring on more violence. They will probably use many arguments, ranging from political to religious to humanitarian.

In the middle of their remarks, without any warning, punch them in the nose.

When the person gets up off the ground, they will be very angry and they may try to hit you so be careful.

Very quickly and calmly remind the person that violence only brings about more violence and remind them of their stand on this matter. Tell them if they are committed to a nonviolent approach to undeserved attacks, they will turn the other cheek and attempt to negotiate a peaceful a solution. Tell them they must lead by example if they really believe what they are saying.

Most of them will think for a moment and then agree that you are correct.

As soon as they do that, hit them again. Only this time hit them much, much harder. Square in the nose.

Repeat steps 2 through 6 until the desired results are obtained and the idiot realizes how stupid an argument he/she is making.

There is no difference in an individual attacking an unsuspecting victim or a group of terrorists attacking a nation of people. It is unacceptable and must be dealt with, perhaps at a high cost. We owe our Military a huge debt for what they are about to do for our children and us. We must support them and our leaders at times like these. We have no choice. Terrorists are not rational and thus will not negotiate. We either strike back, VERY HARD, or we will keep being hit in the nose.

...........It's not as if we haven't covered this here, but I thought at the very least Tippecanoe would come to better understand just how it really is.
 
Joined
Jul 20, 2000
Messages
399
Originally posted by Dark Star
I received this from a friend in Canada this AM, I was going to post it then I thought nah...................

Then I thought twice of it and said, just post it okay fine.

I haven't a clue as to the original source of it, so perhaps some have seen this before.

Krikland (SNIPS) the body of text:

...........It's not as if we haven't covered this here, but I thought at the very least Tippecanoe would come to better understand just how it really is.
OK, we'll kick butt until Ramadan, 2002, punching their home-bound supporters in the nose all that time.

Problem(s)
1. there will always be more of them than there are of those ~actually~ willing to punch.
2. you'll change not one mind punching them out.
3. Jesus says... "Peace" a lot.
Would ~you~ punch Jesus?
The Disciples?
John the Baptist?
Paul?
 
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Messages
1,741
Hey Kirkland, :)

Do you have any ideas (better or otherwise)
for a solution to the current terrorist problem?

Also, what publication(s) are you a reporter
for? (Sorry if I've missed your answer to this
one).

Cheers, Mac
 
Joined
Oct 26, 2001
Messages
57,794
I got these emails from some people and it's something we all need to think about.
They are both touching.
==================================================

I know everyone appreciates the determination of the few that have in
time helped the many get through the hardships they face.


From a speech made by Capt. John S. McCain, USN, (Ret) who represents Arizona
in the U.S. Senate:

As you may know, I spent five and one half years as a prisoner of war during
the Vietnam War. In the early years of our imprisonment, the NVA kept us in
solitary confinement or two or three to a cell.

In 1971 the NVA moved us from these conditions of isolation into large rooms
with as many as 30 to 40 men to a room.

This was, as you can imagine, a wonderful change and was a direct result of
the efforts of millions of Americans on behalf of a few hundred POWs 10,000
miles from home.

One of the men who moved into my room was a young man named Mike Christian.
Mike came from a small town near Selma, Alabama. He didn't wear a pair of
shoes until he was 13 years old. At 17, he enlisted in the US Navy. He later
earned a commission by going to Officer Training School. Then he became a
Naval Flight Officer and was shot down and captured in 1967.

Mike had a keen and deep appreciation of the opportunities this country-and
our military-provide for people who want to work and want to succeed. As part
of the change in treatment, the Vietnamese allowed some prisoners to receive
packages from home. In some of these packages were handkerchiefs, scarves and
other items of clothing. Mike got himself a bamboo needle. Over a period of a
couple of months, he created an American flag and sewed on the inside of his
shirt.

Every afternoon, before we had a bowl of soup, we would hang Mike's shirt on
the wall of the cell and say the Pledge of Allegiance. I know the Pledge of
Allegiance may not seem the most important part of our day now, but I can
assure you that in that stark cell it was indeed the most important and
meaningful event.

One day the Vietnamese searched our cell, as they did periodically, and
discovered Mike's shirt with the flag sewn inside, and removed it. That
evening they returned, opened the door of the cell, and for the benefit of
all us, beat Mike Christian severely for the next couple of hours. Then, they
opened the door of the cell and threw him in. We cleaned him up as well as we
could.

The cell in which we lived had a concrete slab in the middle on which we
slept. Four naked light bulbs hung in each corner of the room. As said, we
tried to clean up Mike as well as we could. After the excitement died down, I
looked in the corner of the room, and sitting there beneath that dim light
bulb with a piece of red cloth, another shirt and his bamboo needle, was my
friend, Mike Christian. He was sitting there with his eyes almost shut from
the beating he had received, making another American flag.

He was not making the flag because it made Mike Christian feel better. He was
making that flag because he knew how important it was to us to be able to
pledge allegiance to our flag and our country

So the next time you say the Pledge of Allegiance, you must never forget the
sacrifice and courage that thousands of Americans have made to build our
nation and promote freedom around the world. You must remember our duty, our
honor, and our country.

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to
the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with
liberty and justice for all."

PASS THIS ON ... and on ... and on!!!!!!

==================================================

Don't mean to inundate you with so much about September 11, 2001,
but this MAY answer some tough questions you may have or help you
answer some questions you may receive. The answers have helped me!!

Dear Family and Friends,
I had a very dear friend question my faith in God right after the
terrorist attack on America. Her question was simply put,
"Where is your God today?" She was very hurt, as all Americans were,
so I tried not to react defensively. Since that moment I have prayed
and grieved over the disastrous events.

However, I believe I have the answer. I know where my God was the
morning of September 11, 2001! He was very busy. First of all, he
was trying to discourage anyone from taking this flight. Those four
flights together held over 1000 passengers and there was only 266
aboard.

He was on 4 commercial flights giving terrified passengers the
ability to stay calm. Not one of the family members who was called
by a loved one on one of the high-jacked planes said that passengers
were screaming in the background. On one of the flights he was giving
strength to passengers to try to overtake the high-jackers.

He was busy trying to create obstacles for employees at the World
Trade Center. After all only around 20,000 were at the towers when
the first jet hit.

Since the buildings hold over 50,000 workers, this was a miracle in
itself. How many of the people who were employed at the WTC told the
media that they were late for work or they had traffic delays.

He was holding up 2-110 story buildings so that 2/3 of the workers
could get out. I was so amazed that the top of the towers didn't
topple when the jets impacted.

Although this is without a doubt the worst thing I have seen in my
life, I can see God's miracles in every bit of it. I keep thinking
about my friend and praying for her every chance I have. I can't
imagine going through such a difficult time and not believing in God.
Life would be hopeless.
 
Joined
Aug 24, 1999
Messages
793
Kirkland,

Ditto (because I know you love that word) what Mac asked.

1) What solutions do you have to the current terrorist problem.

1.a.) You might expand on a long term solution as well.

2) What publications do you work for or submit your work to. All kidding aside, I would and I'm sure others (like Mac) here would be interested in reading your work.

Like most of us here, you seldom pass up the opportunity to demonstrate that you are opinionated, and anyone who posts their military record and personal e-mail address can't be bashful.
 
Joined
Aug 24, 1999
Messages
793
hewee,

There is another thread in this forum called "Look on the Bright Side". If anything demonstrates the bright side of tradgedy, the examples you posted certainly do.
 
Joined
Oct 14, 2001
Messages
2,218
Re:
OK, we'll kick butt until Ramadan, 2002, punching their home-bound supporters in the nose all that time
Problem(s)
1. there will always be more of them than there are of those ~actually~ willing to punch.
2. you'll change not one mind punching them out.
3. Jesus says... "Peace" a lot.
Would ~you~ punch Jesus?
The Disciples?
John the Baptist?
Paul?


Not being a smartypants here, but
1.wheres John's head ?
2. Jesus was crucified
 
Joined
Feb 20, 1999
Messages
51,023
Would ~you~ punch Jesus?
The Disciples?
John the Baptist?
Paul?
Kirkland,

That's irrelevent to the point. Those men (and Jeses) were all ready to die for their beliefs (and some did, as pointed out above). While you may be, there are many Americans that don't believe in your God or any god for that matter and are not willing to die for the sake saving some innocent Afghans.

The other point you miss is that the consequences of Jesus' choice of "turn the other cheek" was pretty much limited to himself. There weren't nuclear bombs, chemical warfare and other weapons of mass destruction at that time. If you turn the other cheek or ignore the theat of these rogue third world nations and leaders, someday ~soon~ they will have the power to remove you and the rest of America from the face of the earth. If you want to save your house, you have to eliminate the termites before they have a chance to bring it down.


One more thins---while you're sacrifice and that of millions of Americans in the name of peace (or nonviolence) may be fine with Jesus and you, you have no right to force that down the throats of Americans. I know you fancy citing the Constitution--well perhaps you've forgotten Separation of Church and State, my liberal ~itarian~ friend?

By the way, what would Jesus think about the killing of unborn children?
 
Joined
Feb 7, 2001
Messages
852
DS:

Your post disappoints me.

Has anyone argued against self defense?

Have some of us not simply argued for a considered response and a moral solution which doesn't destroy thousands upon thousands more innocent people.

Peace at any cost? What bs!

When to go to war is always an immensely complex question. It is no schoolyard bully issue. No single rule can prescribe a reliable course of action.

Certainly, conflicts must be confronted, not avoided; limits must be clear; no must mean no; force should always be a last resort. The first requirement is knowing where to draw the line. Then, you must respond in an appropriate way.

If we were bombing the terrorists for sure, who could object?

This is a war on Afghans. It is a war on civilians. It is a war on Islam. It is bs to say it isn't. And you can't just say tch tch to the collateral damage! It isn't right.
 
Joined
Feb 20, 1999
Messages
51,023
This is a war on Afghans. It is a war on civilians. It is a war on Islam.
Well the Taliban and bin Laden should send you a thank you note with appreciation Tipecanoe, because you've bought their PR strategy hook, line and sinker. They count on people like you because they know they can't win a war with weapons but they can win a public relations war and they count on uninformed and "war is wrong in every situation" attitudes such as yours (thank God your in 5% minority).

Let me ask you something. Is your opinion the same about the US entry into World War II? If not, why was that situation different? (Keep in mind there were hundreds of thousands of civilian casualties).
 
Joined
Oct 14, 2001
Messages
2,218
Im not an educated person, so what I have to say isn't worth the time its taking me to type this probably.
But.... , Thank God... I have the freedom to say something here...
be it right or wrong, its just my opinion.
I think that no matter which... when there are groups of people, either PRO WAR or PRO PEACE..... for whatever their reason... & this is what they truly believe in
...then BOTH are RIGHT.......
because they are doing what "THEY BELIEVE IN".
How can that make them wrong when its what they believe? So, there will always be conflict among us. Im sure many will disagree with what I am saying as well.

The Taliban ... are very devout in what they believe. Unfortunately for them... its going to get
them killed. Same goes for the peace lovers who turn the other cheek.
Theres always going to be someone to attack them & in the case of Bin Ladin, he'll attack those that turn the other cheek.
The majority of Afghans did nothing to leave the country when they knew what was about to happen. Its not the fault of the USA that the civilians/ children / non-Taliban
people are being harmed, although I think its a shame, it can't be helped.
But if we didn't send in the troops at this point...
we might as well have said to them (Bin Ladin especially but not nesessarily ... thinking Saddam Hussein as well)... this is our country but you're welcome to take it
& do what you want with it!
 

Dark Star

Thread Starter
Joined
Jun 8, 2001
Messages
3,054
SavvyLady,

I don't really know what you mean when you say:

"Im not an educated person, so what I have to say isn't worth the time its taking me to type this probably..."

.........I think you have a good understanding of the situation at hand. Your message is focused and to the point.
It does not matter here whether I agree with you or not (I do agree) but more important than that.......

You really need to give yourself some credit, because you appear to be very well read. IMO
Glad you could join us.........

Regards,

DS
 

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