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The Islamic threat: Reality? Backlash?

Discussion in 'Controversial Topics' started by pyritechips, Dec 14, 2011.

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  1. pyritechips

    pyritechips Gone but Never Forgotten Thread Starter

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    I realize that there have been numerous threads in the last ten years on Islam but I want to weigh the extent of real Islamic threat against perception and also any backlash against said threat, real or imagined.

    Burkas banned at citizenship ceremony
    Now, whether pro or con, the above appears to be backlash. It begs the question, does it defend against a real threat or is it simply a political message? It is a far tamer law than the one in France, or even the "Resonable Accommodation" policy of Quebec, but is it a reasonable reaction? Does it attempt to protect a nation's cultural base at the risk or alienating and angering a people that already feel marginalized, or are the protests from those that wish to impose fundamental Islamic restrictions upon host nations in a kind of theological colonization?
     
  2. ekim68

    ekim68

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    Several things: I believe that certain Media go overboard on Islamic Terrorism and look for something behind every door. Obviously, IMO, an agenda... That's not to say there isn't a threat, I just don't think it's so prevalent to overreact on everything.
    But, If someone is gonna try to get citizenship in a different Country, they should abide....I would think that they should respect that Country's rules and culture and not impose their notion of how they should live....Especially by making it a legal issue. If anyone is moving to a Country because they like it or want to, they should accept it as it is, and comply...(y)
     
  3. Knotbored

    Knotbored

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    Veils and burkas are a social not a religious requiirement. many Muslin countries find them obnoxious. Its a method of making females subsurviant and equal to keeping a leash on a ppet.
     
  4. pyritechips

    pyritechips Gone but Never Forgotten Thread Starter

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    Well, that's the rub. To wit (from the same article):

    I think that could be a legal basis for banning them outright, as in France. I know that the Canadian criminal code states that the wearing of a mask or other facial covering is a disguise and illegal. I personally believe that it is a small minority of radicals that are making noise about this to support their agenda. The same issue came up 30 years ago here when fundamentalist Sikhs took the government to court to allow them to wear their turbans as it was a religious item, yet many do not wear them at all. But a law is usually drawn up to counter a threat. Is a woman wearing a veil a threat?

    But as to my first point. Is there a real or perceived Islamic threat? And I mean by the majority of Muslims, not the radicals. I know that there are daily news reports here of some bombing somewhere or other activity. I think the press is pushing the issue. The world seems to need a common threat to keep them on their toes. It used to be communism.
     
  5. aka Brett

    aka Brett Banned

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    Is that you Mike ? {had to do a double take}
    I totally agree with your moral stance on the issue.
    I would like to add my own opinion from a legal standpoint as well.
    The law is the law...no masks means no masks
    Freedom of religion extends to freedom from religion as well {What makes this worse its not really a religious issue but a cultural issue} which is attempting to use a religious right as grounds to be masked at will.
     
  6. pyritechips

    pyritechips Gone but Never Forgotten Thread Starter

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    Brett, I think that illustrates what I implied by backlash. Even far left social liberals have limits to tolerance and at some point everybody will say "enough is enough!". My big question is, is there a need for laws to curtail what some see to be demands for "specail" treatment, using religion as a crutch, or is the media playing up to people's fears? In the everyday world there are numerous complaints of unfair treatment (gays, blacks, Jews, Newfies, etc. ) but is the media ignoring them and picking out all the complaints by Muslims? I honestly do not know. In other words, is our fear of the "Islamic Threat" (ie. Islamophobia) mostly manufactured by the press?
     
  7. aka Brett

    aka Brett Banned

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    IMO the two aren't related/the face would still have to be shown /not based upon fear but based upon the law and Canadian culture.
    I approve of freedom of religion..however all laws should be followed regardless of the religion...if not then the law isnt equally applied to all which defeats the purpose of the law...I spoke about this in a thread a year or two ago involving Jehovah witnesses and them refusing blood to a dieing child /we have another religion here that avoids taxes as well.
    I dont believe in any special laws for religious groups ..if we allow exceptions one could very well state any verse from a bible and demand that as well.

    This is why there has to be defined laws that are upheld and not manipulated beyond by groups demanding otherwise.
    In other words it should never reach that point nor even be up for discussion as it involves special treatments based upon religion and or race.

    What we musnt forget here though is the covering of the face isnt a religious requirement,but more or a cultural practice
    Therefore it shouldnt even be discussed as a religious right by public figures but rather what it is-- a culture clash.
    These people arent coming to Canada to be Canadian,therefore they dont belong, primarily as they refuse to abide by Canadian law {based upon a cultural practice from their prior residence } which IMO should give them a free plane ticket home.
     
  8. pyritechips

    pyritechips Gone but Never Forgotten Thread Starter

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    Well the relationship (as I see it) is:

    • Media hypes Muslim complaints and demands for special treatment.
    • Established Canadians with fear and anger, perceive themselves to feel threatened.
    • Government moves to placate the voters that put them in power by enacting any burqa laws.
    • Anti burqa law angers Muslims, causing them to cry out "discrimination, racism, violation of religious freedoms".
    • Muslim outcry increases established Canadians' sense of fear and hatred...
    • ...and the beat goes on.
    Hell no, Brett! They pay for their tickets out of their own pockets - full price. ;):D
     
  9. Blackmirror

    Blackmirror

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    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burqa
    So its persecution against women
    nothing new there then :rolleyes::D
     
  10. aka Brett

    aka Brett Banned

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    Maybe its a threat as they see the Canadian social structure being torn away...{probably by the older Canadians}
    Toss in those that say the law is the law {which have a very valid point as they are merely not appealing to emotion};)
    Now the Muslims that get upset...well they are not Canadians ...but Muslims as they only offer to cry abuse rather than support Canada.

    I suggest full cavity searches as well before boarding the plane home

    Perhaps worthy of a outright ban..not that I am suggesting such here in this thread..but a legitimate argument could be made based upon what it represents .
     
  11. pyritechips

    pyritechips Gone but Never Forgotten Thread Starter

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    The persecution is that of the women being forced to wear them. The persecution is by those that treat women as property. The persecution is perpetuated by those (luckily a minority) that hold on to antiquated, barbaric practices. Forcing women to cover their faces, and to ban them from social interaction, existed long before Islam did. And the big lie here is that, as I have already stated, covering the face is not required by Islamic law. But the problem we have here in Canada is that some 35 or 40 years ago we made ourselves "Multicultural" by law. That opened the door for any kind of activity previously not acceptable in our society. Right now in Ontario there is a trial on for the quadruple murder of 4 members of a family by the father, son and second wife. It was a mercy killing. There are those that claim that Sharia law should be practiced, in other words that Muslims should be allowed to "take care of their own". The issue is ongoing...

    It is of my opinion (and that of lots of people, both Muslim and non-) that it is up to moderate Muslims to speak out against radicals that are trying to force their unacceptable practices upon a host society in the name of religious freedom.

    Honour killings 'reprehensible': Imam
     
  12. Blackmirror

    Blackmirror

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    Maybe they feel comfortable wearing them in a strange country Jim .
    As for the Honour killings we only have to look in the bible

    Jephthah sacrificed his daughter as a burnt offering: Judges 11:29
     
  13. pyritechips

    pyritechips Gone but Never Forgotten Thread Starter

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    That makes no sense to me. Why would covering the face make one more comfortable? Men don't do it. Women of other religions/cultures don't do it.

    Adrienne Arsenault is an experienced foriegn journalist for CBC television and has reported on the spot in many of the troubled regions of the world, including the invasion of Iraq where she traveled un-embedded and wrote her own copy. But even when she is in the Muslim world in Afghanistan or Iraq or elsewhere she has to cover her head. She doesn't do it because she feels uncomfortable; she does it to secure her own safety. Women are routinely beaten, raped and killed if they betray any Muslim man's honour in certain countries. There was a women recently thrown in jail because she was raped. The rape was her fault.
     
  14. aka Brett

    aka Brett Banned

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    And I might to..but the law states no masks
    As far as honor killings...they are wrong..thats why we have laws.
    We have progressed socially and should not go back in order to appease beliefs of those centuries back.

    But lets take that a step further..lets say the woman didnt want to be Muslim anymore..so why should she die ?
    As her relatives are?...see where I am going with that.
    Its not acceptable by any means..this is why I am against any and all separation
     
  15. pyritechips

    pyritechips Gone but Never Forgotten Thread Starter

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    That bolded statement is a complete non sequitur and need explanation. It has nothing to do with the theme of this thread.
     
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