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what is going to happen to john walker

Discussion in 'Random Discussion' started by wen, Dec 3, 2001.

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  1. wen

    wen Thread Starter

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    i saw on the news tonight your special forces have "saved" an american subject, a john walker.

    he was fighting with the taliban!

    his mother says he was an easily led boy who had been brainwashed?

    what will happen to him now.

    the talk over here is of trying "our" citizens for treason or by using the anti-terrorist laws.

    what do you think will or should happen to him?

    wen
     
  2. brianF

    brianF

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    Was having a discussion about that with my son, he found this and emailed it to me


    -EXPCITE-

    TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE

    PART I - CRIMES

    CHAPTER 115 - TREASON, SEDITION, AND SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITIES



    -HEAD-

    Sec. 2381. Treason



    -STATUTE-

    Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war

    against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and

    comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason

    and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five

    years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and

    shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.
     
  3. ~Candy~

    ~Candy~ Retired Administrator

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    Hmmmm, shall suffer death or imprisonment of not less than 5 years.......pretty close......

    Let me see, I'm John Walker, I'm thinking now.....give me death, give me 5 years, give me death, give me five years.......Hijole (excuse my Spanish) :D

    And people wonder where the respect for laws have gone?????

    And dang, he can't hold office in the US? Can't think of any greater punishment.......
     
  4. deuce

    deuce

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    Well I haven't heard much on this guy but I am assuming he was still a US citizen at the time he was "saved". If this was last year I'm sure he would be tried for conspiring to conspire with a terrorist or something or get to be a lifer or something I'm sure they'll pin him with something to give him that. But this is now and considering the circumstances I think the justice system (if we get the guy back in the US which I don't know if we have as of yet) won't go easy on him at all. I think there are enough radicals out there on US soil that if this guy does get off easy (in the opinion of these radicals) they would stone the judge who did so... :rolleyes: My opinion is that we may not see anything short of the Rosenbergs... or else he will just get life and be forced to watch home videos of the people who were killed in WTC for whom he was fighting with (afgani) and against(us) :D... either way I'm sure his punishment will be harse to set an example for others... especially if his judge takes his crime personally... (which isn't supposed to happen and he theoretically would get a new trial) anyway... I'm just rambling... time to saunter on back to my thread... :eek: :rolleyes: :)

    Candy your spanish is excused and justified... (I would have been saying the same thing-plus more-if I were him... :cool: and now I wouldn't be able to kill all those blasted americans in war anymore... boohoo... :D :rolleyes: ) Fortunatly for you Mike doesn't censor spanish... :D


    Hummmm.... noticed Mike put up the christmas banner already... :)
     
  5. littlemar

    littlemar

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    The information I heard about "Walker" which is what he went by while fighting, converted to Islam when he was 16, he was brought up Catholic. He moved to that country when he was 18.
    His mom stated that he always cared for the people in need, and was shy and quiet.

    Okay, what I'm thinking is where was mom when he was 16 and changed religion. I'm not against the change but you're not an adult at 16. His moving there at 18 - as a mom I would have a whole lot to say to this young man.

    I feel that he should be judged as a terriorist, which would also carry the punishment for that. I'm hoping that he didn't kill any of his former countrymen. I also think that statute should be revised. It's just a slap on the hand as far as punishment goes.

    :mad: littlemar

    I like the Christmas lights on the banner. :)
     
  6. marioh

    marioh

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    He should be tried for treason by a military tribunal, and if found guilty, put in front of a firing squad.

    He has betrayed his family, his friends, and most importantly, his country.
     
  7. littlemar

    littlemar

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    I just heard his dad on the radio, he states that he would like to give him a hug and then a kick in the butt for going to Afganistan without permission. So where was this kick earlier, I always knew where my kids were when they were young. This kid needs to be punished for what he did against his own country. And his parents need to get a clue.

    littlemar
     
  8. ~Candy~

    ~Candy~ Retired Administrator

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    He's a 20 year old man......I don't think he needed to ask for permission to go.......
     
  9. Mulderator

    Mulderator

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    Well, I don't have any sympathy for the guy, but legally, is what he did actually treason or a crime against the US? Remember he was there BEFORE we attacked. Let's take RandyG for a moment as I like picking on him. He's an American who moved to Ireland and lives there. Let's say for whatever reason we had some disagreement with Ireland and attacked the country. Would RandyG be guilty of treason if he fought on the side of his new adopted country?

    My point is the guy was part of the Taliban when we attacked and remember we are not really at war with the Taliban. If they had turned over bin Laden, none of this would be happening. Many of the Taliban foot soldiers don't want to be fighting any more than any of the Americans over there, so if the war was to end today, would we try all of them? Of course not--only the high ranking leaders that made the decisions much like the war crime trials following the fall of Nazi Germany.

    It really is an interesting legal question, but I wouldn't jump to the conclusion he committed treason because he was fighting with the Taliban.
     
  10. Dark Star

    Dark Star

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    Mulder,

    I don't think there is any wiggle room here for the guy.

    I think the president made it clear........... "you are either with us or you are against us"

    I do not see any "grey" areas and it's like you're either pregnant or you're not.....there is no "almost" about it is there?

    I do not think that anyone held this guy at gunpoint and made him do anything, he is 20 years old and legally an adult. Treason is a crime and he was clearly involved in an act of treason.
    Wrong place, wrong time, doing the wrong thing.........accountability comes to mind here.

    DS
     
  11. littlemar

    littlemar

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    Mulder:

    You've made me think and I do see your point about the legal and moral question. I'm unsure if we're not "at war" with the Taliban, since I feel that our government knew they wouldn't hand over anyone.

    So another thought is when the Taliban captures someone from the Northern Afganistan group do you think there is even a chance for debat about treason against their country. Probably not, they'd be shot where they stood. We always talk first before making a decision.

    I guess since my son is in the Army my emotions do play a role. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.

    :)
     
  12. Dark Star

    Dark Star

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    Hiya Mary,

    I think we're both replying to Mulder at about the same time.....

    "I'm unsure if we're not "at war" with the Taliban"

    These are the guys that harbour(sp?) terrorist and have been shooting at us.

    DS
     
  13. THoey

    THoey

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    I agree that he was there before things started and so I don't know if I see that as treason. But, this "man" made a choice to support the Taliban. As such, whether he is or was an American citizen should not matter. He should be treated as all other Taliban soldiers. Whether that means shot at when/if he was attempting to shoot at our boys, or held in a prison camp with all other captured Taliban soldiers. After this is all over with (years from now), I think his citizenship should be removed and never allowed to step foot in the U.S. again (if he lives that long)...
     
  14. littlemar

    littlemar

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    Dark Duck

    "remember we are not really at war with the Taliban. If they had turned over bin Laden, none of this would be happening."

    I agree that they have been harboring terriorists and shooting at us but I was responding to the above statement from Mulder.

    It might not be declared a war with the Taliban but it is a war against the terriorists and if the shoe fits.... They also were yelling death to the infidels (sp) and cheered the killing at the WTC.

    Like I stated earlier the USA debates issues before making decisions. They don't. So it will be a while before any decision will be made about "Walker" (did he do any of the cheering? I wonder)
     
  15. marioh

    marioh

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    Mulder, you bring up a good point.

    But let's look at the definition of the word treason :

    http://dictionary.cambridge.org/define.asp?key=treason*1+0



    (from Cambridge International Dictionary of English)

    treason
    noun
    (the crime of) lack of loyalty to your country, esp. by helping its enemies or attempting to defeat its government


    According to this definition, he would fall under the terms of treason. He has helped our enemies (last time I checked, we didn't drop bombs on our friends) and has shown a lack of loyalty to his country of birth (by fighting against his country on behalf of our enemy). All are grounds to be accused of treason.
     
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